How do you Design a Defense to Stop the Athletic Quarterbacks?

[Mcganiel]

Is Mahomes just another Reid creation? He looked god awful for three quarters. the niners took the middle of the field away and forced him to the sidelines. They also took the deep routes away, Mahomes should have been able to dink and dunk them to death but couldn't.

Andy Reid Has Remarkable Track Record Of Success With NFL Quarterbacks - NESN.com

FOXBORO, Mass. — It’s a widely-held belief that great NFL teams need great quarterback play, and there’s no better example than the New England Patriots, who have won four Super Bowls under the direction of Tom Brady. As a head coach, Andy Reid hasn’t had a quarterback quite like Brady, who his...

nesn.com

 

[fansinceGWilson]

Although you are obviously taking it to an extreme to make a point, you are correct.

Everything cannot be accurately measured using simple metrics, without context.

Being able to run the ball effectively is helpful in many situations, as is being able to air it out 40 times a game. It depends on the situation. That's why most good teams have a pretty fair balance over the course of a season.

If you are down, you obviously have to pass to catch up. If you are up, being able to have time consuming drives, while your D is resting, and the opponent's D is wearing down is an asset.

Agree with that. There seem to be some who see everything as either/ or. This is not one of those. I'm in the better-passing-improves-chances-of-winning camp, but not at the expense of a neutered run game. Good passing teams need at least an average run game. May not be stats to back that, but that's my belief

 

[Ray R]

There are, obviously, indirect ways to 'stop' a mobile QB, but not for individual games. Cap space is one. KC's O is more than Mahommes. It will be tough to keep all the top players over time. Scoring more points than KC is another. Easier said than done, but 4-5 non-potent Os put 28-30 points on them.Their D ranked pretty high, but, IMO, was inconsistent. Keep fresh players in. In the 4Q, SF's D looked exhausted. As with any potent O, don't give up big plays. I'm certain others will chime in with more.

I also noticed that the SF defense was dragging between plays. They were very tired.

 

[Mach2]

Agree with that. There seem to be some who see everything as either/ or. This is not one of those. I'm in the better-passing-improves-chances-of-winning camp, but not at the expense of a neutered run game. Good passing teams need at least an average run game. May not be stats to back that, but that's my belief

IDK about stats, but it is common sense.

The problem with analytics is that rarely are things that involve humans as definitively black and white as mathmatic equations require.

You would have to break things down to, virtually, a play by play basis, taking into account point differential, down and distance, opponent strength and tendencies, just to name a few.

Then, by the very nature of what you are trying to prove, or disprove, values would have to be "weighted", and that leads to human subjective opinion.

You can have all the stats, and theories in the world, but it all comes down to coaching, gameplans, and execution.

Talent doesn't hurt either.

 

[Kamelion4291]

IDK about stats, but it is common sense.

The problem with analytics is that rarely are things that involve humans as definitively black and white as mathmatic equations require.

You would have to break things down to, virtually, a play by play basis, taking into account point differential, down and distance, opponent strength and tendencies, just to name a few.

Then, by the very nature of what you are trying to prove, or disprove, values would have to be "weighted", and that leads to human subjective opinion.

You can have all the stats, and theories in the world, but it all comes down to coaching, gameplans, and execution.

Talent doesn't hurt either.

Data never lies. Human interpretation does.

 

[marino13zach54]

I think SF did a great job with Mahomes. He's just baller and bound to make plays with his feet.

To me, the difference was that KC nutted up and blitzed and blitzed hard when the game was on the line. Imagine if they hadn't blitzed Garappolo on that final deep pass wherein the WR had three steps on 2 DBs. He might had made that throw.

I know SF's style is not to blitz but you had them up against the wall. All you had to do was make sure you didn't give Mahomes enough time to make the big play and in the one instance that Mahomes had all day to throw, the 4.2 flash found an open spot and the throw was perfect.

Now I don't have an answer for a Jackson because that guy looks like a Madden game out there.

I say let a QB beat you with his feet. If he does so, then he's a beast and that's that. But you can't allow for both letting him rip you giving him plenty of time in the backfield AND letting him run.

In the end it wasn't a Mahomes running that beat SF. Sure, Mahomes kept drives alive with his legs which kept KC in the game. But overall, early in the game, he didn't look as stellar as he usually did throwing the ball.

I would've nutted up and blitzed Mahomes not giving him time to make the big pass. I would've been content to have him make quick reads and beat me that way.

 

[1972forever]

Is Mahomes just another Reid creation? He looked god awful for three quarters. the niners took the middle of the field away and forced him to the sidelines. They also took the deep routes away, Mahomes should have been able to dink and dunk them to death but couldn't.

Andy Reid Has Remarkable Track Record Of Success With NFL Quarterbacks - NESN.com

FOXBORO, Mass. — It’s a widely-held belief that great NFL teams need great quarterback play, and there’s no better example than the New England Patriots, who have won four Super Bowls under the direction of Tom Brady. As a head coach, Andy Reid hasn’t had a quarterback quite like Brady, who his...

nesn.com

The 49ers have an excellent defense and they had two weeks to prepare to play against the Chiefs offense. They were able to apply pressure and Bosa was eating Fishers lunch for most of the game. I don’t care how great a QB you are, it is tough to complete passes when you are running for your life.

While he certainly wasn’t overly effective through the first three quarters, he made the plays when the game was on the line and the Chiefs won because of his ability to play well when they needed him the most. That is what true franchise QB’s are expected to do.

While having Reid as his head coach coming into the league has certainly benefitted Mahomes, I certainly wouldn’t call him a Reid creation. I would take him over any QB in the NFL today or any college QB in the 2020 or 2021 draft.

 

[EasyRider]

Is Mahomes just another Reid creation? He looked god awful for three quarters. the niners took the middle of the field away and forced him to the sidelines. They also took the deep routes away, Mahomes should have been able to dink and dunk them to death but couldn't.

Andy Reid Has Remarkable Track Record Of Success With NFL Quarterbacks - NESN.com

FOXBORO, Mass. — It’s a widely-held belief that great NFL teams need great quarterback play, and there’s no better example than the New England Patriots, who have won four Super Bowls under the direction of Tom Brady. As a head coach, Andy Reid hasn’t had a quarterback quite like Brady, who his...

nesn.com

[/QUOTE

he was playing against a superstar defense that was in the SB. He had problems adjusting as any great QB would but hung in like a stud until he saw a few moments and capitalized on them. That’s what great QBs can do. He didn’t get distracted or frustrated and fold

 

[Mach2]

Data never lies. Human interpretation does.

That was my point.

The raw data can tell you generalities for sure, but it can not easily give you specifics. Football is a team sport, requiring the cohesiveness of very flawed individual humans. It is not possible to take every factor into account, for every possible variable.

That not even getting into the biases of the ppl who are "crunching the numbers". It isn't usually even intentional. It is just human nature.

 

[dolfan91]

Keeping an athletic QB in the pocket was always a good way to defend against them. Once they get outside or are able to maneuver around and navigate the pocket, it usually means bad things are about to happen to a defense. Mahomes did his thing in the 2nd half and won a Super Bowl. The Niners had him locked up in the 1st half, they got away from that discipline in the 3rd and 4th quarters and lost.

 

[Kamelion4291]

That was my point.

The raw data can tell you generalities for sure, but it can not easily give you specifics. Football is a team sport, requiring the cohesiveness of very flawed individual humans. It is not possible to take every factor into account, for every possible variable.

That not even getting into the biases of the ppl who are "crunching the numbers". It isn't usually even intentional. It is just human nature.

I agree. And to further increase the difficulty, there are only 16 games of evidence for each team a season. It isn't baseball with 162. I don't know how you could justify an analytics department in this sport tbh.

 

[Ray R]

There is an old baseball saying that can apply equally well to football.

Hit 'em where they ain't.

In other words, get the ball to a position on the field where there aren't any defenders by using blocking, running and passing. This seems to be what game planning and play calling is all about.

In reality, you can say a player is probably a good selection if he meets any 2 of these 3 important qualifications: Bigger, Faster, or Quicker. Pick any two and you probably will end up with someone you can use.

Bigger & Faster (typically a receiver) means they probably aren't going to be too Quick. A lot of players in this category take a little time to build up a lot of speed. The laws of physics work against them being Quicker.

Bigger & Quicker (typically a lineman) means they are not likely to be Faster. The laws of physics indicate it may take more time to get an increased payload up to speed.

Faster & Quicker (typical of some, but not all QB's and kick returners) means they are not likely to be Bigger, or at least less then 260 pounds. Keep in mind that linemen are getting to be well over 300 pounds which I consider Bigger.

Physics always wins out, anyway, that's what my physics professor always said.


If you can find someone with all three characteristics, get them!!!

 

[Mach2]

I agree. And to further increase the difficulty, there are only 16 games of evidence for each team a season. It isn't baseball with 162. I don't know how you could justify an analytics department in this sport tbh.

I would disagree with that. Analytics is very valuable when assessing tendencies, both the opponents, and your own. This can be very complex, and the coaches usually do not have the time, nor the background, to do the job as well as a dedicated dept, headed up by a person with a degree in statistical analysis.

 

[Ray R]

The 49ers have an excellent defense and they had two weeks to prepare to play against the Chiefs offense. They were able to apply pressure and Bosa was eating Fishers lunch for most of the game. I don’t care how great a QB you are, it is tough to complete passes when you are running for your life.

While he certainly wasn’t overly effective through the first three quarters, he made the plays when the game was on the line and the Chiefs won because of his ability to play well when they needed him the most. That is what true franchise QB’s are expected to do.

While having Reid as his head coach coming into the league has certainly benefitted Mahomes, I certainly wouldn’t call him a Reid creation. I would take him over any QB in the NFL today or any college QB in the 2020 or 2021 draft.

"I would take him over any QB in the NFL today or any college QB in the 2020 or 2021 draft."

Now you tell me!

 

[nick1]

Mahomes is unstoppable. That was the best defense the nfl has and yes Mahomes struggled a little but he still lead a comeback