Mel Kiper- Jake Long is a Left Tackle

[jim1]

That is my point exactly. If you trust your eyes at the combine then you will be deceived. No doubt about it. You need to trust the tape. How did a guy play against Illinois, or Ohio State, or Florida. When you view it from that angle and watch play in and play out I think you will be disappointed.

On Saturdays is how a player will be graded by the smart teams. That said, Long will run a good forty, but that does not make him a left tackle.

JLong was crushing the Gators from what I recall. He's rated in the top 5 for a reason, more specifically the top 2 or 3. I see your argument but I think that you take it too far. The guy is a hell of a player.

 

[The Confessor]

That is my point exactly. If you trust your eyes at the combine then you will be deceived. No doubt about it. You need to trust the tape. How did a guy play against Illinois, or Ohio State, or Florida. When you view it from that angle and watch play in and play out I think you will be disappointed.

On Saturdays is how a player will be graded by the smart teams. That said, Long will run a good forty, but that does not make him a left tackle.

That game against Illinois is the one I keep eluding to. Perhaps it was an anomole for Jake Long, but he was absolutely OWNED in that game.

The fact he only gave up one sack is very decieving...what I saw with MY eyes in that game alone would constitute looking for somebody else with the coveted #1 overall...I think it will for Parcells and company as well.


Now then, IF Ireland, Parcells and Saprano decide he is the #1 overall, I will welcome him aboard whole-heartedly, as they obviously know MUCH more about evaluation that I do, and I would feel confident that the Illinois game was indeed an anomole, ...I would just be VERY VERY surprised if it pans out that way.

 

[fishypete]

That is my point exactly. If you trust your eyes at the combine then you will be deceived. No doubt about it. You need to trust the tape. How did a guy play against Illinois, or Ohio State, or Florida. When you view it from that angle and watch play in and play out I think you will be disappointed.

On Saturdays is how a player will be graded by the smart teams. That said, Long will run a good forty, but that does not make him a left tackle.

I give up...I'll wait till the combine is over and see what the opinon is from people that really know.

 

[Ghetti13]

You just don't get it. First of all, we won't hear from the people who really know at any point throughout this process. We will hear from the talking heads and we will see where a guy was drafted. We will not know what the consensus is about a player. All we know is what we see with our own eyes. That's it and that is what I rely on.

Secondarily, the combine is merely a very small portion of the process. Guys run well all the time who struggle on the field. Long is one of those players. He will perform well at the combine, but it really won't matter. The tape does not lie. He has some holes in his game.

 

[BlueFin]

Since the Dolphins will run more than pass...he'll be perfect...and with all that said...Long only gave up one sack all season last year...so that makes my point.

I see your point, Jake Long protected his quarterback well in college so that guarantees he'll be able to pass block against the much faster and more athletic NFL pass rushers?No Pete, college numbers don't ensure NFL success, anymore than high school success ensures college success.

 

[fishypete]

I see your point, Jake Long protected his quarterback well in college so that guarantees he'll be able to pass block against the much faster and more athletic NFL pass rushers?No Pete, college numbers don't ensure NFL success, anymore than high school success ensures college success.

O.K. Blue...so with your thinking...we should throw away all stats...not watch any games...and just throw darts on draft day? If your thinking is correct for him...it has to be the same for every other player...otherwise your thinking is faulty.

 

[padre31]

I am reluctant to label him an excellent right tackle. I am more comfortable with describing him as an adequate right tackle. I say this because excellent right tackles make up for their athletic limitations with excellent strength. Cherilus does not do this. He is limited athletically with average strength. That is why I believe he will be merely adequate to the point where he is always on the fringe of being replaced.

Hmm, well in Gosder's favor, he was moved to LT and did a passable job, he is a RT

 

[BlueFin]

O.K. Blue...so with your thinking...we should throw away all stats...not watch any games...and just throw darts on draft day? If your thinking is correct for him...it has to be the same for every other player...otherwise your thinking is faulty.

Its like this Pete, you have to evaluate the skillset of the player to project him to the NFL, when it comes to left tackles, the pass rushers he could handle in college do not usually equal the speed of the blind side rushers in the NFL. When it comes to this aspect of his game, evaluate his performance against college pass rushers that are considered to have NFL talent and speed, and discard the film of most of his performances against inferior talent that will not make it to the big leagues.

 

[fishypete]

Its like this Pete, you have to evaluate the skillset of the player to project him to the NFL, when it comes to left tackles, the pass rushers he could handle in college do not usually equal the speed of the blind side rushers in the NFL. When it comes to this aspect of his game, evaluate his performance against college pass rushers that are considered to have NFL talent and speed, and discard the film of most of his performances against inferior talent that will not make it to the big leagues.

Normally I would agree with you...but I don't see the Dolphins having the need for a pure pass blocking LT...if anything a road hog would be a better fit. Can you tell me if Long played well against Florida...or USC...or O.S.? Those are three top teams with top players...that he had to play against. How many sacks did he give up against those three teams?...if you know.

 

[csabe]

He only gave up one sack last year.

He did but there is a very big difference between the Big 10 and the NFL.

 

[Boomer]

If Williams and Albert were sitting there at #32 who would you take? If Cherilius were there at #57 would you even consider playing Carey at Guard (assuming Williams or Albert were to play LT)?

I keep going through this in my mind and keep coming to the same conclusion- we can resolve the long standing OL issues in this draft if we want to, and if we do so we may have the foundation of one of the best offensive lines in football. Finally.

LOL....Jim my man.....give me an east question!!!

I'd take......Albert.

If Cherilus was there at 57, you'd be hard pressed to pass him up. Because you could play Carey at LT. Albert at LG, Satele at OC, TBC at RG and Cherilus at RT.

 

[Boomer]

Otah is super raw...another LT project...we have had enough of them.

2007: Finished second in the voting for the Lombardi Award and Outland Trophy…Unanimous All-Big Ten Conference first-team pick and named the league's Offensive Lineman of the Year for the second-straight season…Added Academic All-Big Ten Conference honors… Hugh R. Rader Jr. Memorial Award recipient as Michigan's top offensive lineman and received the Mike Gittleson Award, given to the U-M player who exhibits a resolute work ethic and commitment to preparing for the game...Served as team captain for the second consecutive campaign, starting all thirteen games at left offensive tackle…Helped the team average 385.1 yards per game…The Wolverines amassed 1,251 of their 2,144 yards on the ground over Long's left tackle position, as he registered 119 knockdowns, including 18 touchdown-resulting blocks…Allowed only one quarterback sack on 423 pass plays and was penalized just once, finishing with an 87.85% grade for blocking consistency…Also recorded one solo tackle. All-American, started all 13 games at left tackle in '06. Missed time w/ankle injury. Played in final five games and started four games at left tackle in '05. All-Big Ten second team in '04. Did not see game action in '03.

Only one sack on 423 pass plays. What more do you want?
There's no perfect LT...only great ones...and he's the Dolphins best and only chance with the first pick....of course we could get lucky and find a trading partner and trade down...then what....select the next best player...there's risk in every player. We have to finally take care of the LT position....without that I don't care who the QB will be for the Dolphins...he won't have the time to make plays...he'll be running for his life as they have since Webb left.

3 things.

1. If you'd seen Otah, you'd know he wasn't "super raw"
2. Why do you keep quoting meaningless stats and awards at me about Long. Watch him play. Clarkston Hines was the best statistical WR in college history. I don't see him in the pros. Trevor Cobb was the best TB in NCAA football and he's not in Canton. Gordie Lockbaum? Steve Taylor? Charlie Ward?
3. I forgot point 3.

 

[Boomer]

I give up...I'll wait till the combine is over and see what the opinon is from people that really know.

What's the Combine going to tell you that 4 years of game tape isn't?

 

[The Confessor]

3 things.

1. If you'd seen Otah, you'd know he wasn't "super raw"
2. Why do you keep quoting meaningless stats and awards at me about Long. Watch him play. Clarkston Hines was the best statistical WR in college history. I don't see him in the pros. Trevor Cobb was the best TB in NCAA football and he's not in Canton. Gordie Lockbaum? Steve Taylor? Charlie Ward?
3. I forgot point 3.

You're up drinking again arent you Boom?

 

[Boomer]

I wish.