Merged X12: Ongoing Henne vs. Sanchez Debate...

[nyjunc]

I am very surprised you still think this way Cane, you too smart a guy for that, don't let his last minute success in the playoffs fool you, if not for the running game, you see not Sanchez in the playoffs like Henne, and have even worse memories of his regular season. They both have a lot to prove or there will be new starters in front of them.

he gets it, he's not just looking at stats and rankings. Those who dig deeper undersatnd our ground games were similar, they understand our D wasn't great and our run game was very inconsistent needing to be bailed out by our pass O.

 

[tay0365]

Eff stats.

Watch the games.

Sanchez is better than Henne period. Stop throwing hypotheticals that if you take away this this and this he's terrible.

DUH.

Take away this this and this from Tom Brady and he's average. That's the argument everyone makes when some QB is better than the trash we run out there on Sunday...especially a division rival.

I live in jersey, and I watch both play, neither is better then the other, Henne is able to take control of games by himself better then Sanchez, and Sanchez is a bit more consistant with more quality receivers and a better running game, but neither has been to this point the QB you want to go to war with.

 

[tay0365]

Yeah, God forbid you surround the most important position on the team with HELP of any sort lol.

That is the thing, without the talent, Sanchez has been the inferior QB, not by much, but still a step below

Sports fans are ridiculous. Everyone wants to see the QB do it ALL and turn trash into gold. Everyone wants to see LeBron beat five guys by himself for a title. Everyone wants to see one guy do it all. Why? It doesn't work that way.

This is why they are called fans (Short for fanatics), all sports fans are crazy, some go so far for their teams, they can't see the truth that they are not as good as they think, same as some are so crazy not to be thought of as a homer, they will continue to trash their team, even though they may also be totally wrong.

It's a team sport. Mark Sanchez works with what he has. Chad Henne has Brandon Marshall and can't even get the ball to him.

He also had an O-coordinator that is known for one of the most boring and uninventive offenses in football...I know, we need to stop blaming Henning, and give more of the blame to Henne, but it is, what it is, Henne is a very young QB, and Henning got in head, that much anyone that had eyes were able to see if they wee paying attention.

 

[tay0365]

he gets it, he's not just looking at stats and rankings. Those who dig deeper undersatnd our ground games were similar, they understand our D wasn't great and our run game was very inconsistent needing to be bailed out by our pass O.

So if someone agrees with you, they get it, if they disagree, they know nothing...got it.

 

[nyjunc]

That is the thing, without the talent, Sanchez has been the inferior QB, not by much, but still a step below



This is why they are called fans (Short for fanatics), all sports fans are crazy, some go so far for their teams, they can't see the truth that they are not as good as they think, same as some are so crazy not to be thought of as a homer, they will continue to trash their team, even though they may also be totally wrong.



He also had an O-coordinator that is known for one of the most boring and uninventive offenses in football...I know, we need to stop blaming Henning, and give more of the blame to Henne, but it is, what it is, Henne is a very young QB, and Henning got in head, that much anyone that had eyes were able to see if they wee paying attention.

You act like Henne had no talent which is ludicrous.

The same OC that once was an OC for a team w/ Jake delhomme at QB and helped them get to a SB. The same OC that w/ Chad P as his QB won the division.

So if someone agrees with you, they get it, if they disagree, they know nothing...got it.

Anyone saying Sanchez sucks doesn't have a clue what they are watching. Most average fans struggle to evaluate QBs b/c they solely use fantasy #s- we have the same problem w/ our fans. It's not a Jets vs. dolphins thing it's an NFL fans thing unfortunately.

 

[Clipse]

Everything I said is true. Never said Sanchez was great. But I did say that he's better than Henne and anyone trying to argue otherwise is just upset that Chad Henne sucks and there's still hope for Mark Sanchez.

And for the record, Josh Freeman is the real deal.

Sanchez is better than Henne. But we're talking about ultra ****ty vs. plain old ****ty. I can barely see a difference.

 

[tay0365]

You act like Henne had no talent which is ludicrous.

The same OC that once was an OC for a team w/ Jake delhomme at QB and helped them get to a SB. The same OC that w/ Chad P as his QB won the division.

Delhomme (& henning) were lucky to be on a team with such a great defense (At that time, considered to have the best D-line in Football), and that team was known for its running game, not passing game, Delhomme job was do just enough to help his team but not lose it....I do grant you he had a great post-season, but that was more due to Henning not holding him back, in 2009, Henne was allowed to play, and he looked like a much better QB then in 2010. In Henning's offense the running game has to work, last year it didn't, yet there was Henning calling Running plays and wildcat plays in the most crucial times.

Anyone saying Sanchez sucks doesn't have a clue what they are watching. Most average fans struggle to evaluate QBs b/c they solely use fantasy #s- we have the same problem w/ our fans. It's not a Jets vs. dolphins thing it's an NFL fans thing unfortunately.

I watched Sanchez, and threw many more balls then Henne off mark, he threw way more balls that should have been intercepted (Luck is one thing Sanchez did not lack last year), and at times when thing did not go right, he does see to get a bit nervous (He needs his receivers to make plays for him, or he gets into trouble).

What is happening to you, happens to many fans, just because their team made it deep into the playoffs, they think they know how to evaluate QB or other positions, and think it must be the player they like, instead of evaluating the team and why they did so well.

It's pretty simple, The Jets have no running game.....they have no offense The Jets don't have no offense....they have no playoffs The Jets have no Playoffs.....The Jets start to see that their QB had few big plays, and almost was intercepted 3 times more then heactually was.

Both Henne and Sanchez are in the same boat, to think less only shows you have yet to learn how to evaluate QBs, have to pay more attention, or are waering your green colored glasses too long.

 

[nyjunc]

Delhomme (& henning) were lucky to be on a team with such a great defense (At that time, considered to have the best D-line in Football), and that team was known for its running game, not passing game, Delhomme job was do just enough to help his team but not lose it....I do grant you he had a great post-season, but that was more due to Henning not holding him back, in 2009, Henne was allowed to play, and he looked like a much better QB then in 2010. In Henning's offense the running game has to work, last year it didn't, yet there was Henning calling Running plays and wildcat plays in the most crucial times.



I watched Sanchez, and threw many more balls then Henne off mark, he threw way more balls that should have been intercepted (Luck is one thing Sanchez did not lack last year), and at times when thing did not go right, he does see to get a bit nervous (He needs his receivers to make plays for him, or he gets into trouble).

What is happening to you, happens to many fans, just because their team made it deep into the playoffs, they think they know how to evaluate QB or other positions, and think it must be the player they like, instead of evaluating the team and why they did so well.

It's pretty simple, The Jets have no running game.....they have no offense The Jets don't have no offense....they have no playoffs The Jets have no Playoffs.....The Jets start to see that their QB had few big plays, and almost was intercepted 3 times more then heactually was.

Both Henne and Sanchez are in the same boat, to think less only shows you have yet to learn how to evaluate QBs, have to pay more attention, or are waering your green colored glasses too long.

In 3 out of their 4 playoff games that year the Carolina offense scored 29 pts. They won in that postseason more w/ offense and if the carolina D didn't blow they would have won the SB.

They ran the ball well but they also threw it really well too. Delhomme threw 6 TDs and 1 INT in their 4 playoff games.

You think henning saw henne could play in 2009 then held him back in 2010? or do you think henne's struggles forced his hand?

Luck like the 2 INTs against GB that were NOT INTs, like the 2 dropped TDs that likely would have resulted in 2 more wins. EVERY QB has dropped INTs, it happens.

Sanchez is pretty cool under pressure, he performed really well in close games late and in huge postseason games.

You can say that for pretty much any team outside of 2-3 offenses- most teams need to run the ball. We ran it ok last year, we weren't a great running team. If we relied on the run game we don't make the playoffs last year. in '09 the run game carried the O, in '10 the pass O was more important.

Henne and Sanchez are not in the same boat. The Jets KNOW they have their franchise QB, Miami is still looking for theirs. That's really all we need to know. those that just look at #s think they are close, those that truly understand the game know the truth.

 

[tay0365]

In 3 out of their 4 playoff games that year the Carolina offense scored 29 pts. They won in that postseason more w/ offense and if the carolina D didn't blow they would have won the SB.

They did have a great playoff run,

They ran the ball well but they also threw it really well too. Delhomme threw 6 TDs and 1 INT in their 4 playoff games.

No they were a running team, you probably don't remember, but they were a running team, in the playoffs, Delhomme did look really good.

You think henning saw henne could play in 2009 then held him back in 2010? or do you think henne's struggles forced his hand?.

No, instead he saw that in the final few games of 09, he had thrown more INTs then in all the other games, and instead of working with him and helping him get better passing the ball for 2010, he decided to put all his money on the running game, did not allow him to throw much in the 1st few games, then got in his head to be agressive, but not to make mistakes, and in doing so totally got Henne nervous, and made him start thinking about his passes, and questioning himself, something he did not do in 09.

Luck like the 2 INTs against GB that were NOT INTs, like the 2 dropped TDs that likely would have resulted in 2 more wins. EVERY QB has dropped INTs, it happens.

Face it, you tally all the dropped TDs to INTs of every QB in the league, and Sanchez still should get on his knees and do some serious thanking

Sanchez is pretty cool under pressure, he performed really well in close games late and in huge postseason games.

I agree he is not horrible under pressure, but he is also far from being really good, what I said is, when things start going wrong, the cool Sanchez, is not so cool and collected.

You can say that for pretty much any team outside of 2-3 offenses- most teams need to run the ball. We ran it ok last year, we weren't a great running team. If we relied on the run game we don't make the playoffs last year. in '09 the run game carried the O, in '10 the pass O was more important.

Umm, The Jets were 2nd in the NFL in attempts running the ball, so I think the Jets Coaches did rely mostly on the runs compared to the pass which were 18th,and they were 4th in running yards compared to 22nd passing. Take away the run, the Jets are watching not playing in the playoffs.

Henne and Sanchez are not in the same boat. The Jets KNOW they have their franchise QB, Miami is still looking for theirs. That's really all we need to know. those that just look at #s think they are close, those that truly understand the game know the truth.

If the Jets struggle running the ball this year, watch next year if the Jets get a QB in the draft or FA. The Jets know one thing, as long as the Runing game is going, Sanchez is doing just enough not to blow it for them, they will stick with Sanchez in hope that eventually one day he become the QB they hope him to become. Right now he is a young QB that needs to be severly protected by a running game and great defense.

 

[nyjunc]

They did have a great playoff run,



No they were a running team, you probably don't remember, but they were a running team, in the playoffs, Delhomme did look really good.



No, instead he saw that in the final few games of 09, he had thrown more INTs then in all the other games, and instead of working with him and helping him get better passing the ball for 2010, he decided to put all his money on the running game, did not allow him to throw much in the 1st few games, then got in his head to be agressive, but not to make mistakes, and in doing so totally got Henne nervous, and made him start thinking about his passes, and questioning himself, something he did not do in 09.



Face it, you tally all the dropped TDs to INTs of every QB in the league, and Sanchez still should get on his knees and do some serious thanking



I agree he is not horrible under pressure, but he is also far from being really good, what I said is, when things start going wrong, the cool Sanchez, is not so cool and collected.



Umm, The Jets were 2nd in the NFL in attempts running the ball, so I think the Jets Coaches did rely mostly on the runs compared to the pass which were 18th,and they were 4th in running yards compared to 22nd passing. Take away the run, the Jets are watching not playing in the playoffs.



If the Jets struggle running the ball this year, watch next year if the Jets get a QB in the draft or FA. The Jets know one thing, as long as the Runing game is going, Sanchez is doing just enough not to blow it for them, they will stick with Sanchez in hope that eventually one day he become the QB they hope him to become. Right now he is a young QB that needs to be severly protected by a running game and great defense.

The final few games of '09 henne had pressure to win for the first time and he failed.

You can make all the excuses about henne being nervous, his failures were on him not the OC.

Can we add the dropped recs, dropped INTs and remove the BS INts he had?

He is EXCELLENT under pressure. The comebacks he led, the agmes he has played in postseason. He may not have good gams now and then but it's not b/c of pressure. he never buckles from pressure.

2nd in attempts, 8th in YPC- not a good combo. We were a balanced team, almost run/pass 50/50.

2009 we ran it 607 times and passes 393 times
2010 we ran it 534 and pssed 525

We needed the pass game to overcome the struggles in the run game in numerous games.

Take away the run like in denver, det, Cle, Houston, Pitt,...

The Jets are set at QB for the next decade, if sanchez takes a step back this year they won't be looking for a QB but don't hold your breath hoping he'll be bad. He's only going to get better and better.

Do great defenses blow a million late leads? Our D was good to very good, it was not great. You guys o verrate our D and running game to try to make mark look bad. We had a good/very good D and a good running game. We lost the 2 title games b/c of our defense not b/c of our QB.

 

[Cali Finfan]

It's a QB league.

You're not getting to two consecutive AFC title games with a below average QB anymore.

This league has built everything around the QB and offense.

Not saying Sanchez is great, but he's a lot better than Henne and he still hasn't hit his ceiling.

There have been many instances where teams get to the AFC championship game multiple times with below average QBs. Sometimes they are even able to win the SB. Sanchez is not above average. You are looking some beer goggles at that one. Just like Henne, he has shown instances of being good but more often, just like Henne, he struggles very badly. This has been a silly debate for some time.

 

[nyjunc]

There have been many instances where teams get to the AFC championship game multiple times with below average QBs. Sometimes they are even able to win the SB. Sanchez is not above average. You are looking some beer goggles at that one. Just like Henne, he has shown instances of being good but more often, just like Henne, he struggles very badly. This has been a silly debate for some time.

Please provide those examples and let me know how many did it back to back years. I'd love to see this list.

 

[nyjunc]

Check out the comments, these kids/adults are friggin ridiculious. All Sanchez over there. One comment said henne would struggle Alot and another said Sanchez can take the Jets 11-5....where has football logic gone?

I'm not one who bumps old threads but I came across this one and these comments are pretty funny b/c this is exactly what happened.

 

[Aqua Shadow]

I will not let Junc get the last word in a 69 page long thread....

 

[nyjunc]

I will not let Junc get the last word in a 69 page long thread....

This topic has a long way to go.