phins_4_ever
E12 FH Tailgate Gang
dam. That will be an interesting finish in that group.
***Official 2018 FIFA World Cup thread***
- Thread starter phins_4_ever
- Start date
Serbia played to win at the end . . . I don’t blame them. A win would of saw them through . . .a tie would of been better than a loss but still would of put them in a tough spot with likely needing to win vs. Brazil or hope the Swiss tie or lose to Costa Rica.
phins_4_ever
E12 FH Tailgate Gang
LOL. That is not how you play a WC though (or any tournament on any level). You don't go for broke in a 1-1 game. Go for the win? Sure. But no total offense that you are exposed for a counter attack with no defenders left. "Shaq" wasn't even offside because he was still on his side of the field. A point would have given Serbia 4 points, tied with Brazil and 2 points ahead of Switzerland.
You never ever start calculating "what if that team does this in the next game, and we may do this."
In a tournament with a couple or three games the 1st rule is: do not give games away. Your error of margin is slim. Take a tie if you have to. Go for the win without exposing your defense in a tie game. They were playing like they were a goal down and in danger if exiting the WC.
We can calculate possibilities but a team playing in a tournament does not.
There was a very interesting interview today with Jogi Loew. Reporters were listing all these scenarios which are possible. His answer was simple: We don't care what Mexico does or Sweden does in their next game. We just win our games, score goals and advance.
I highly doubt that any of the Serbia players were thinking about their next game or what Switzerland could do against Costa Rica. They simply screwed up and lost the vision on the field. I am sure in the moment when that pass was taken they all were like "what the **** happened? Why is nobody back there?" Lost in the moment.
The players definitely weren’t thinking about calculations but the Serbian coaches were, at least near the end of this game. But I agree with you, they seemed to go for broke like they would be eliminated instead of just continuing to attack and not bog down for a tie.
Yogi Low gave an appropriate answer, but he is the hunted, #1 team in the world. I mean he has to say that doesn’t he? Especially with 0 points so far.
Serbia has to go up against a Brazil side that still have not qualified and the Swiss are going against a Costa Rica team that is already eliminated. It’s a little different of a scenario so I get the aggression to go for 3 points as that philosophy was likely their most favorable chance of moving on to the next round.
But that high line was ridiculous and kudos to the Swiss for the quick counter and Shaquiri for the finish.
Yogi Low gave an appropriate answer, but he is the hunted, #1 team in the world. I mean he has to say that doesn’t he? Especially with 0 points so far.
Serbia has to go up against a Brazil side that still have not qualified and the Swiss are going against a Costa Rica team that is already eliminated. It’s a little different of a scenario so I get the aggression to go for 3 points as that philosophy was likely their most favorable chance of moving on to the next round.
But that high line was ridiculous and kudos to the Swiss for the quick counter and Shaquiri for the finish.
phins_4_ever
E12 FH Tailgate Gang
I doubt that the coaches were thinking that. I forgot his name but the Serbian coach played professional soccer in Germany as well and was part of the 2006 WC squad of Serbia and Herzegovina. In addition to that he was defender in his playing days. These coaches are always more defensive minded. There is no way that he would tell his team to go that high up and leave the defense exposed unless they are playing for their very last chance in the WC.
It was a team failure. In the heat of the moment they forgot where they were, didn't pay attention where everybody was and the last man standing back there did not tell some of his players to back off. That is the job of a center back.
Oliver Kahn said it quite well after the game: The team had a complete brain fart.
phins_4_ever
E12 FH Tailgate Gang
Oh, one more thing: if that was indeed a coaching decision I'd fire his ass immediately regardless if there was still a game to be played. :laugh
phins_4_ever
E12 FH Tailgate Gang
Speaking of games to be played - tomorrow's games are:
Group F:
The big game of course is Germany vs Sweden. A loss for the German team and they can make flight reservations home. A tie would not eliminate them but make it nearly impossible to advance. Only a win will do it. Sweden struggled against South Korea and only a PK saved them 3 points. Sweden is technically a very strong defensive team which will be a challenge for Germany's offense to find gaps.
The last time both teams met was during the WC qualifiers for the 2014 WC. Both teams combined for 16 goals (!!!) in two games. In the first game they tied 4-4 after Sweden came back from an 0-4 deficit which was the first time a German National team gave up a 4-goal lead and the second game was won by Germany 5-3.
A win for Sweden will almost assure them a spot in the knockout round (depending on the South Korea vs Mexico game).
On the German side Hummels is probably out (injury) and should Hector be healthy again he will replace Plattenhart on the left side. Hummels will probably replaced by Ruediger. Loew is tight lipped about possible changes. Several options are available such as replacing Khedira with possibly Goretzka and Reuss for Draxler. Also not off the table is a system change in which Khedira, Guendokan (instead of Oezil) and Kroos are playing.
Personally I think Loew will make minimal changes and will replace Werner with Gomez, Hector for Plattenhart, Brandt for Draxler and Ruediger for Hummels.
Germany is facing two different WC histories. The last time Germany lost an opener in the WC was in 1982 (1-2 vs Algeria). Despite that loss and the other game of shame (they called it the non-aggression pact vs Austria) Germany went on to the finals. In 2010 Spain lost the opener vs Switzerland (which was not a very good team back then) and went on to win the WC.
On the other hand you have defending WC Champion Spain getting knocked out in group play in 2014 after losing the opener. But Spain was only following Italy which in 2010 was also knockout in group play as defending Champion.
The warning signs are there: Pay attention and remember the last two defending champions and their quick exits.
Especially the 2014 knockout by Spain seems like an eerie similar setup. After losing the opener against Netherlands, Spain lost against Chile and beat Australia. Now substitute Netherlands, Chile and Australia with Mexico, Sweden and South Korea. One European team, one team from the Americas and one team from the AFC - all similar strengths in those years. Germany is forewarned.
Mexico (vs South Korea) will change its game philosophy back to what they have done prior to the WC - attacking soccer. The win against Germany can be credited to the brilliance of the Mexico's coach Osoria. He completely change the philosophy and soccer culture, caught Germany by surprise and took advantage of individual mistakes by German players and the inability/refusal by coach Loew to adjust. We can expect a much more offensive minded Mexico team against South Korea which will benefit South Korea as well. I think we can expect an entertaining game. If Mexico gets rid of all the brain farts on offense (they should have beaten Germany by 3 or 4 goals) the team will ride the high from the Germany game through the SK game and into the knockout stages. But god forbid the South Korean team takes a lead.
Tomorrow this group can go from "Mexico/Sweden are in-Germany/SK are out" to "Mexico almost in-Sweden/Germany/SK fight to live on" to "complete cow dunk" in which the entire group is tied at 3 points before the final group play next week. Two interesting games tomorrow.
Group G
This group will open game day 2 with one game (Belgium vs Tunisia) with the completion a day later (England vs Panama).
For many Belgium is one of the teams which plays in the shadows of the big names but could have a breakthrough this year. I have them as a possible semi finalist as well. Belgium did what good teams do and took care of an inferior and completely outmatched opponent in game 1 by beating Panama 3-0. Tunisia will be a little tougher though. Tunisia is trying to recover from a tough opening loss to England in which the Three Lions scored the winner in stoppage time. That loss puts Tunisia in a situation where they have to win against Belgium to have any chance to advance to the knockout stages. This game should be quite entertaining as both teams prefer to be offensively active.
Group F:
The big game of course is Germany vs Sweden. A loss for the German team and they can make flight reservations home. A tie would not eliminate them but make it nearly impossible to advance. Only a win will do it. Sweden struggled against South Korea and only a PK saved them 3 points. Sweden is technically a very strong defensive team which will be a challenge for Germany's offense to find gaps.
The last time both teams met was during the WC qualifiers for the 2014 WC. Both teams combined for 16 goals (!!!) in two games. In the first game they tied 4-4 after Sweden came back from an 0-4 deficit which was the first time a German National team gave up a 4-goal lead and the second game was won by Germany 5-3.
A win for Sweden will almost assure them a spot in the knockout round (depending on the South Korea vs Mexico game).
On the German side Hummels is probably out (injury) and should Hector be healthy again he will replace Plattenhart on the left side. Hummels will probably replaced by Ruediger. Loew is tight lipped about possible changes. Several options are available such as replacing Khedira with possibly Goretzka and Reuss for Draxler. Also not off the table is a system change in which Khedira, Guendokan (instead of Oezil) and Kroos are playing.
Personally I think Loew will make minimal changes and will replace Werner with Gomez, Hector for Plattenhart, Brandt for Draxler and Ruediger for Hummels.
Germany is facing two different WC histories. The last time Germany lost an opener in the WC was in 1982 (1-2 vs Algeria). Despite that loss and the other game of shame (they called it the non-aggression pact vs Austria) Germany went on to the finals. In 2010 Spain lost the opener vs Switzerland (which was not a very good team back then) and went on to win the WC.
On the other hand you have defending WC Champion Spain getting knocked out in group play in 2014 after losing the opener. But Spain was only following Italy which in 2010 was also knockout in group play as defending Champion.
The warning signs are there: Pay attention and remember the last two defending champions and their quick exits.
Especially the 2014 knockout by Spain seems like an eerie similar setup. After losing the opener against Netherlands, Spain lost against Chile and beat Australia. Now substitute Netherlands, Chile and Australia with Mexico, Sweden and South Korea. One European team, one team from the Americas and one team from the AFC - all similar strengths in those years. Germany is forewarned.
Mexico (vs South Korea) will change its game philosophy back to what they have done prior to the WC - attacking soccer. The win against Germany can be credited to the brilliance of the Mexico's coach Osoria. He completely change the philosophy and soccer culture, caught Germany by surprise and took advantage of individual mistakes by German players and the inability/refusal by coach Loew to adjust. We can expect a much more offensive minded Mexico team against South Korea which will benefit South Korea as well. I think we can expect an entertaining game. If Mexico gets rid of all the brain farts on offense (they should have beaten Germany by 3 or 4 goals) the team will ride the high from the Germany game through the SK game and into the knockout stages. But god forbid the South Korean team takes a lead.
Tomorrow this group can go from "Mexico/Sweden are in-Germany/SK are out" to "Mexico almost in-Sweden/Germany/SK fight to live on" to "complete cow dunk" in which the entire group is tied at 3 points before the final group play next week. Two interesting games tomorrow.
Group G
This group will open game day 2 with one game (Belgium vs Tunisia) with the completion a day later (England vs Panama).
For many Belgium is one of the teams which plays in the shadows of the big names but could have a breakthrough this year. I have them as a possible semi finalist as well. Belgium did what good teams do and took care of an inferior and completely outmatched opponent in game 1 by beating Panama 3-0. Tunisia will be a little tougher though. Tunisia is trying to recover from a tough opening loss to England in which the Three Lions scored the winner in stoppage time. That loss puts Tunisia in a situation where they have to win against Belgium to have any chance to advance to the knockout stages. This game should be quite entertaining as both teams prefer to be offensively active.
I agree. Löw will make minimal changes but there’s one thing that is 100% clear: Marco Reus will start. I don’t know who he will replace in the starting lineup but if he doesn’t start and Germany screws up, Löw is fired right after the World Cup. Marco Reus is currently being treated as THE savior in the German media.
Other than that Hector is a given when healthy and I’d personally like to see Khedira and Özil replaced. I like Goretzka and Brandt as players but I don’t see them starting this year. Löw will rely too much on his proven players.
One thing I’d like to add and which is different to previous World Cups is that even the games which feature “smaller” football countries are quite interesting and not as boring as they used to be. I think the first three games were unwatchable (Russia vs Saudi Arabia, Egypt vs Uruguay and Marocco vs Iran) but Spain and Portugal sort of kicked it off and the games since have been very entertaining.
lmao if Low starts Gomez.
Werner was whippin the Mexican backline and these experienced midfielders didn't care to give him any service.
A team that already lacks speed and then sending their fastest player to the bench (for maybe their slowest lol) would just be funny to me.
Keep Werner up top. Behind him needs to be Reus and you know Mueller will be there. Kroos will also be slotted in the midfield.
That where you have to make decisions. 2 spots and 5 players. Ozil, Khedira, Draxler, Goretska and Brandt. My guess is Ozil and Draxler but Draxler was kind of iffy in the first game and Brandt looked fresh and hungry so maybe that could happen. But I really don't wanna see Khedira out there.
The backline will be Kimmich/Boateng/Hummels/Hector. If Hummels can't go I think maybe Sule gets the nod due to his Bayern ties and familiarity with Boateng.
In the end Neuer said it best.
@Manuel_Neuer: "We didn't play with the right body language against Mexico and that can't happen again. From now on, every game is like a final."
The body language, especially in the midfield, was sorry. Even with no changes to the starting 11, if the body language changes, they will be fine.
Werner was whippin the Mexican backline and these experienced midfielders didn't care to give him any service.
A team that already lacks speed and then sending their fastest player to the bench (for maybe their slowest lol) would just be funny to me.
Keep Werner up top. Behind him needs to be Reus and you know Mueller will be there. Kroos will also be slotted in the midfield.
That where you have to make decisions. 2 spots and 5 players. Ozil, Khedira, Draxler, Goretska and Brandt. My guess is Ozil and Draxler but Draxler was kind of iffy in the first game and Brandt looked fresh and hungry so maybe that could happen. But I really don't wanna see Khedira out there.
The backline will be Kimmich/Boateng/Hummels/Hector. If Hummels can't go I think maybe Sule gets the nod due to his Bayern ties and familiarity with Boateng.
In the end Neuer said it best.
@Manuel_Neuer: "We didn't play with the right body language against Mexico and that can't happen again. From now on, every game is like a final."
The body language, especially in the midfield, was sorry. Even with no changes to the starting 11, if the body language changes, they will be fine.
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Tunisia shot themselves in the foot this game. You can’t beat a team like a Belgium when you turn the ball over in your end so carelessly. What good is saving potential throw ins and corners if you save it to the other team.
Other than that I saw some decent play from them. Their play didn’t deserve this blowout . . . .their turnovers did.
Other than that I saw some decent play from them. Their play didn’t deserve this blowout . . . .their turnovers did.
phins_4_ever
E12 FH Tailgate Gang
I agree. I'd like to see Reus as well. Reus missed the last Euro and the 2014 WC because of injury right before the tournament. Reus could come in instead of Brandt for Draxler.
phins_4_ever
E12 FH Tailgate Gang
That's why Loew is driving the German media nuts the last week. Everybody is panicking and he is the Mr Cool. He actually mocks them in a way by saying things like "After all these years and now one loss, everything we've ever done is wrong". :laugh
Yeah credit to El Tri last week but Germany just kind of bored. They do have to change the mindset though cause again, the "minnows" in this tournament are bunching teams in the mouth.
Also Coutinho>Neymar
phins_4_ever
E12 FH Tailgate Gang
:laugh