Report sheds new light on Miami Dolphins’ bold offseason, Jaylen Waddle selection | Page 10 | FinHeaven - Miami Dolphins Forums

Report sheds new light on Miami Dolphins’ bold offseason, Jaylen Waddle selection

BigNastyFish said:
People act as if every draft slot comes with some kind of guarantee or predetermined "performance certification."

There's ZERO guarantee a player selected #6 is going to be a superior pro to a player selected #26.

Sometimes it's just like -- it's pick #6 and you have to take somebody but the odds are (historically) there's a better pick!

Folks need to let things develop and stop all this formula driven nonsense!
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I agree with you fishy, the NFL tends to be hit or miss for everyone but a few teams like Baltimore
 
Minny just traded thier former 1st rounder Hughes for 6th round pick swap. Wow what a failure. Has the Minny FO been fired yet?
 
hoops said:
pick 6 good? Let’s bet a baby ruth on it
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I will take that bet. I had the WRs in this Draft for Mia as Waddle/Smith 1A/B, Chase as 2. Between Waddle and Smith I had Waddle as the higher upside but Smith as a safer pick.

Waddle to me has the highest upside if any WR in the draft. He is the most gifted from a physical standpoint. Waddle has rare type of speed. He has the combination of speed that you just don't see come around very often. He has true deep speed as a 4.3 type player but also has short area speed/quickness. Most guys that possesses that short area speed/quickness (the wiggle) don't run 4.3. Good example of this is guys like Edelman who has elite short area speed runs a 4.0 shuttle and a 6.6 3 cone but then runs a 4.6 40. While a guy like Fuller has deep speed 4.3 40 but ran a 4.27 shuttle and a 6.9 3 cone. This is why I hate when people compare Waddle to Ruggs. To different types of speed Ruggs is like Fuller. Sucks we don't have Waddles numbers but just watch the film Waddle has elite quickness. Also watch the 40 yard run against Ruggs. Waddle plows out Ruggs early while Ruggs makes up the ground on the back half. This is why you see the Waddle to Hill comparison, Hill is one of the few that runs a 4.3 40 combined with a 6.6 3 cone time. Just try and find guys that gave that combo in the NFL it is very very rare.

Another reason I like the Waddle pick is because of what I believe Miami wants to due on Offense. I see people say well you don't take a slot guy top 10, ya maybe 10 years ago the slot is targeted at 35% in the NFL now. Also I see a NE type offensive philosophy going forward. They will attack from the inside out in the passing game. Last season they didn't have the players to play that style, zero quick WRs and zero deep WRs (well that were any good at least). Basically the middle was always games up as safeties also played up and corners played up as Miami had nobody that a DC would fear at all. Now look at Miami's moves on O. They bring in Fuller now you have outside speed. They draft Waddle there is the quick guy (Edelman/Welker) with the added bonus of elite deep speed. Draft Long as another TE to work the middle if the field out.

To me fit matters a lot more then people give credit to at times. Plus I will admit I am assuming things when it comes to the type of O they will run. But the moves they made plus coaches from NE lead me to believe this is what they want to do. I also believe Tua is better fit for this type of offense, timing and accuracy over the middle, deep fades on the outside (accuracy/touch matters more then pure arm strength). If they run this style O Waddle is a great fit the slot gets a lot of targets get him the ball and let him make plays. If they start to over commit on Waddle over the middle you look outside to Fuller deep or the TEs leak out into the flats.

Also go back and look at Waddles Freshman film. He works over the middle a lot that year because Lock (OC) used the slot more then Sark did.
 
dan the fin said:
I will take that bet. I had the WRs in this Draft for Mia as Waddle/Smith 1A/B, Chase as 2. Between Waddle and Smith I had Waddle as the higher upside but Smith as a safer pick.

Waddle to me has the highest upside if any WR in the draft. He is the most gifted from a physical standpoint. Waddle has rare type of speed. He has the combination of speed that you just don't see come around very often. He has true deep speed as a 4.3 type player but also has short area speed/quickness. Most guys that possesses that short area speed/quickness (the wiggle) don't run 4.3. Good example of this is guys like Edelman who has elite short area speed runs a 4.0 shuttle and a 6.6 3 cone but then runs a 4.6 40. While a guy like Fuller has deep speed 4.3 40 but ran a 4.27 shuttle and a 6.9 3 cone. This is why I hate when people compare Waddle to Ruggs. To different types of speed Ruggs is like Fuller. Sucks we don't have Waddles numbers but just watch the film Waddle has elite quickness. Also watch the 40 yard run against Ruggs. Waddle plows out Ruggs early while Ruggs makes up the ground on the back half. This is why you see the Waddle to Hill comparison, Hill is one of the few that runs a 4.3 40 combined with a 6.6 3 cone time. Just try and find guys that gave that combo in the NFL it is very very rare.

Another reason I like the Waddle pick is because of what I believe Miami wants to due on Offense. I see people say well you don't take a slot guy top 10, ya maybe 10 years ago the slot is targeted at 35% in the NFL now. Also I see a NE type offensive philosophy going forward. They will attack from the inside out in the passing game. Last season they didn't have the players to play that style, zero quick WRs and zero deep WRs (well that were any good at least). Basically the middle was always games up as safeties also played up and corners played up as Miami had nobody that a DC would fear at all. Now look at Miami's moves on O. They bring in Fuller now you have outside speed. They draft Waddle there is the quick guy (Edelman/Welker) with the added bonus of elite deep speed. Draft Long as another TE to work the middle if the field out.

To me fit matters a lot more then people give credit to at times. Plus I will admit I am assuming things when it comes to the type of O they will run. But the moves they made plus coaches from NE lead me to believe this is what they want to do. I also believe Tua is better fit for this type of offense, timing and accuracy over the middle, deep fades on the outside (accuracy/touch matters more then pure arm strength). If they run this style O Waddle is a great fit the slot gets a lot of targets get him the ball and let him make plays. If they start to over commit on Waddle over the middle you look outside to Fuller deep or the TEs leak out into the flats.

Also go back and look at Waddles Freshman film. He works over the middle a lot that year because Lock (OC) used the slot more then Sark did.
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🤝
 
dan the fin said:
I will take that bet. I had the WRs in this Draft for Mia as Waddle/Smith 1A/B, Chase as 2. Between Waddle and Smith I had Waddle as the higher upside but Smith as a safer pick.

Waddle to me has the highest upside if any WR in the draft. He is the most gifted from a physical standpoint. Waddle has rare type of speed. He has the combination of speed that you just don't see come around very often. He has true deep speed as a 4.3 type player but also has short area speed/quickness. Most guys that possesses that short area speed/quickness (the wiggle) don't run 4.3. Good example of this is guys like Edelman who has elite short area speed runs a 4.0 shuttle and a 6.6 3 cone but then runs a 4.6 40. While a guy like Fuller has deep speed 4.3 40 but ran a 4.27 shuttle and a 6.9 3 cone. This is why I hate when people compare Waddle to Ruggs. To different types of speed Ruggs is like Fuller. Sucks we don't have Waddles numbers but just watch the film Waddle has elite quickness. Also watch the 40 yard run against Ruggs. Waddle plows out Ruggs early while Ruggs makes up the ground on the back half. This is why you see the Waddle to Hill comparison, Hill is one of the few that runs a 4.3 40 combined with a 6.6 3 cone time. Just try and find guys that gave that combo in the NFL it is very very rare.

Another reason I like the Waddle pick is because of what I believe Miami wants to due on Offense. I see people say well you don't take a slot guy top 10, ya maybe 10 years ago the slot is targeted at 35% in the NFL now. Also I see a NE type offensive philosophy going forward. They will attack from the inside out in the passing game. Last season they didn't have the players to play that style, zero quick WRs and zero deep WRs (well that were any good at least). Basically the middle was always games up as safeties also played up and corners played up as Miami had nobody that a DC would fear at all. Now look at Miami's moves on O. They bring in Fuller now you have outside speed. They draft Waddle there is the quick guy (Edelman/Welker) with the added bonus of elite deep speed. Draft Long as another TE to work the middle if the field out.

To me fit matters a lot more then people give credit to at times. Plus I will admit I am assuming things when it comes to the type of O they will run. But the moves they made plus coaches from NE lead me to believe this is what they want to do. I also believe Tua is better fit for this type of offense, timing and accuracy over the middle, deep fades on the outside (accuracy/touch matters more then pure arm strength). If they run this style O Waddle is a great fit the slot gets a lot of targets get him the ball and let him make plays. If they start to over commit on Waddle over the middle you look outside to Fuller deep or the TEs leak out into the flats.

Also go back and look at Waddles Freshman film. He works over the middle a lot that year because Lock (OC) used the slot more then Sark did.
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I appreciate the fact that you didn’t just drop a lame ass one liner and take off on me. You just don’t know how much I appreciate that. Now I’m not sure I agree with all of it but I get where your coming from. Folks are underrating that long addition. That dude can do work in the middle of the field if teams have to concentrate on other guys. But I think one thing waddle has to show on the Edelman aspect of things is that level toughness. Edelman was tough as nails.

does waddle have that level dog in him? We gonna find out.

as for fit ive seen mentioned a lot by some credible folks even but I will just ask you this does a Julio jones for example produce regardless of scheme? That answer is a absolute yes. Calvin Johnson same. When we start worrying about fit so much we are trying to offset some aspect of something else that probably shouldn’t be getting drafted top 6 (in any class cause that’s how I grade) in terms of ideal value in the first place.
 
This was a disastrous decision. Lance is a bonafide franchise QB talent. Pitts is a generational TE prospect and Chase might become the league’s best WR. Since we don’t have a franchise QB we’ll regret this for the next 10–15 years just like we will passing on Herbert. Nothing Waddle does will outweigh that. Even if Waddle is excellent, he’ll need to be better than the combined first round picks it cost to move up. This will be another fireable offense for Grier not that Ross will ever wake up and do it
 
FinFaninSeattle said:
This was a disastrous decision. Lance is a bonafide franchise QB talent. Pitts is a generational TE prospect and Chase might become the league’s best WR. Since we don’t have a franchise QB we’ll regret this for the next 10–15 years just like we will passing on Herbert. Nothing Waddle does will outweigh that. Even if Waddle is excellent, he’ll need to be better than the combined first round picks it cost to move up. This will be another fireable offense for Grier not that Ross will ever wake up and do it
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This post is going to age amazingly, let’s revisit this in 12 months lol
 
FinFaninSeattle said:
This was a disastrous decision. Lance is a bonafide franchise QB talent. Pitts is a generational TE prospect and Chase might become the league’s best WR. Since we don’t have a franchise QB we’ll regret this for the next 10–15 years just like we will passing on Herbert. Nothing Waddle does will outweigh that. Even if Waddle is excellent, he’ll need to be better than the combined first round picks it cost to move up. This will be another fireable offense for Grier not that Ross will ever wake up and do it
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So you know that Lance is going to be a great NFL QB and that Tua is already a bust. You also assume that Pitts and Chase will be great in the NFL. While saying no matter what Waddle does the Dolphins have already lost. So by your standards had the Dolphins stayed at 3 and taken Pitts or Chase it would have been a huge failure unless whichever of those guys they had taken end up being better than the combined first round picks they would have lost by not moving down. Basically no matter what Grier and the Dolphins would have done you would have seen it as a failure.
 
joenhre said:
So you know that Lance is going to be a great NFL QB and that Tua is already a bust. You also assume that Pitts and Chase will be great in the NFL. While saying no matter what Waddle does the Dolphins have already lost. So by your standards had the Dolphins stayed at 3 and taken Pitts or Chase it would have been a huge failure unless whichever of those guys they had taken end up being better than the combined first round picks they would have lost by not moving down. Basically no matter what Grier and the Dolphins would have done you would have seen it as a failure.
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Yeah... he'll fit right in here.

:BNK:
 
nick1 said:
Remember the Gesicki vs goedert debate? I think we won that one
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It absolutely boggles my mind when I see some of the takes on Tight End play here.

It seems as the entire board understands that the NFL is now a passing league, and that the rules have been written to make this so, but then a good percentage of those same people want a old-style Y-type Tight End... even though they mostly don't exist in today's wide open offenses.

I'm just not sure how they can see the first idea, but not the second. Tight Ends were primarily blockers in the old run dominant days... H-back types were almost Fullbacks... another position that basically doesn't exist anymore.

Shannon Sharpe, Tony Gonzales, Antonio Gates... none of these guys were asked to block much. Hell... when they lined up tight, THEN the defenses were confused...

But some of Finheaven seems to want Mike Ditka.

I'll never understand it.
 
Player A: 137 receptions, 1,465 yards, 12 TD

Player B: 125 catches, 1,475 yards, 11 TD

Mike Gesicki and Dallas Goedart
 
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