Saban and the Chiefs | Page 5 | FinHeaven - Miami Dolphins Forums

Saban and the Chiefs

Sban is not going to give up Surtain for a fourth rounder. If he did, he would be reliquishing his stone cold attitude of sticking to the value chart. Noone would take him seriously if he went against the very thing that he said he was going to do. You do not want to start off your carreer that way in the pros. Trust me. For all you KC fans out there, I say you guys are in big trouble unless you can get your hands on a CB who can cover Randy Moss even in the slightest possible way, Otherwise you will be bottom feeders to Denver, Oakland, and San Diego (not neccessarily in that order) IMO, KC is the best pick to be bottom feeders this year. Your defense still sucks!
 
WvFinFan said:
if we trade down with the bucs i think saban will except a 4th this year and 2nd next year. If not i think he will wait and see what happens on draft day and if nothing happens maybe accept a 1st day choice on day 1 next year.
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good point, I think that would be a good long term strategy for us, especially considering our salary cap issues. We may not be able to pay for all these picks if we trade down this year.
 
I understand KC is backed up as well, but if youdont realize that the Dolphins are back up too, you dont understand the managerial part of this business. (I dont either, but I try):wink:

Miami will be have cap issues if they keep surtain and trade down in the 1st... no one realizes how much cap hit 1st rounders take + you can only prorate it for 5 seasons now makeing the cap hit bigger... you are thinking you will get 3 1st rounders from (Tampa and Minny) a whole lot of 2nd rounders, if you think this is possible you need to shoot yourself... Maybe if you trade surtain a second 1st rounder is possible... but other than that Miami needs to wake up,

Im not saying the chiefs will not pony up a 2nd rounder, and I am not saying Surtain isnt worth it (I think he is worth a #1 pick, but no other GM does at this point - not even a 2nd) . Wouldnt you think that others would have already traded Surtain for a second if that was it... I know a lot of defenses that need it, but none are interested because of what Surtain wants $$$ wise...

I understand that the chiefs will have a horrible time if they do not get Surtain, we still have an option w/ law but thats worst case scenario....

Chiefs will be in trouble if the trade doesnt get done, Miami will be in trouble if the trade does not happen, who will be in more trouble.. I dont know and you dont know... So I will leave fins heaven at the request of the miami fans, i guess opinios that are based on facts arent well tolerated by some of you, I had fun and good luck this season... your schedule is tough...
 
The Chiefe will have to offer the 2nd .If Miami is rumoured to trade down that lessons the chance that they are desperate for a 2nd rounder and the Chiefs will then fess up there's from a fourth to a second.I wouldn't budge if I were Saban.Surtain is too good for anything less than second rounder.
 
carlos3652 said:
So I will leave fins heaven at the request of the miami fans, i guess opinios that are based on facts arent well tolerated by some of you, I had fun and good luck this season... your schedule is tough...
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Your comments and opinions are good. Just because a few loose cannons on this board slam you, don't assume that the majority of Finheaven folks concur.

I, for one, appreciate a diff perspective and I think it makes us all better fans for it. Keep up the good work and keep posting. :up: Forget the negative responses...they just come w/ the territory.
 
Dbergan said:
Your comments and opinions are good. Just because a few loose cannons on this board slam you, don't assume that the majority of Finheaven folks concur.

I, for one, appreciate a diff perspective and I think it makes us all better fans for it. Keep up the good work and keep posting. :up: Forget the negative responses...they just come w/ the territory.
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:) Thanks, Im just used to Chiefsplanet where no one bashes anybodys opinion, we disagree and try to base it on facts... it seems like a lot of people here dont like hearing both sides of the story on this deal and that Surtain is the best option for the dolphins right now when clearly there is a better avenue the Dolphins can be taken to better their future... if we offer a 4th and a 2nd, I think it will be a steal for the chiefs, but on the other hand it will be better than keeping Surtain in the long run, especially if they can trade down with TB and Minny and get a 2nd rounder that way...

I hope this deal gets done, i would have already given Saban his #2 for him, but I am not a GM, and no GM has offered that ( I dont think I will be a GM anytime soon:wink: ) so Im not sure whats going to happen...
 
carlos3652 said:
Both Chiefs fans and Dolphins are being stupid about this trade...

Chiefs fans need to realize that we need defense in a really bad way, Surtain is our only healthy option at this point. We have very good WR in our division and we will need all the help we can get... We have 2 good years with our core offense before we lose them (Trent, O line, Priest) and we need to take advantage of this window.

Dolphin fans need to realize that Saban has 5 picks in this years draft and thats not enough, also TB will not trade with them in the end and no other teams will be in the mix for Surtain until after the draft because this draft has 8-10 cb's that will be good NFL players... Law is also an option, not healthy now but come season time, I have no doubt he will be good for whoever he plays...
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carlos3652 said:
I understand KC is backed up as well, but if youdont realize that the Dolphins are back up too, you dont understand the managerial part of this business. (I dont either, but I try):wink:

Miami will be have cap issues if they keep surtain and trade down in the 1st... no one realizes how much cap hit 1st rounders take + you can only prorate it for 5 seasons now makeing the cap hit bigger... you are thinking you will get 3 1st rounders from (Tampa and Minny) a whole lot of 2nd rounders, if you think this is possible you need to shoot yourself... Maybe if you trade surtain a second 1st rounder is possible... but other than that Miami needs to wake up,

Im not saying the chiefs will not pony up a 2nd rounder, and I am not saying Surtain isnt worth it (I think he is worth a #1 pick, but no other GM does at this point - not even a 2nd) . Wouldnt you think that others would have already traded Surtain for a second if that was it... I know a lot of defenses that need it, but none are interested because of what Surtain wants $$$ wise...

I understand that the chiefs will have a horrible time if they do not get Surtain, we still have an option w/ law but thats worst case scenario....

Chiefs will be in trouble if the trade doesnt get done, Miami will be in trouble if the trade does not happen, who will be in more trouble.. I dont know and you dont know... So I will leave fins heaven at the request of the miami fans, i guess opinios that are based on facts arent well tolerated by some of you, I had fun and good luck this season... your schedule is tough...
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A. I like you honest analysis of the situation. We do have a need to get rid of Pat. Anyone that says we don't have the need is blinded by Dolphin passion (which isn't the worst thing in the world). We do have options, but most people believe that trading Pat would be the best. You, too, have options. But again, most people believe that trading FOR Pat would be the best option.

B. I agree with the opinion that Saban has drawn a line in the sand and will probably ot compromise as this is really his first deal. I'm guessing that he doesn't want to be sen as "soft" to other GM's. This might be one where pride comes in the way of good judgement.

C. I don't think all of us want you to lave. You have logical opinions and can discuss this rationally without the trash talking. Though a new poster, I respect your opinions (most of them).

Bigbucks
 
carlos3652 said:
:) Thanks, Im just used to Chiefsplanet where no one bashes anybodys opinion, we disagree and try to base it on facts... it seems like a lot of people here dont like hearing both sides of the story on this deal and that Surtain is the best option for the dolphins right now when clearly there is a better avenue the Dolphins can be taken to better their future... if we offer a 4th and a 2nd, I think it will be a steal for the chiefs, but on the other hand it will be better than keeping Surtain in the long run, especially if they can trade down with TB and Minny and get a 2nd rounder that way...

I hope this deal gets done, i would have already given Saban his #2 for him, but I am not a GM, and no GM has offered that ( I dont think I will be a GM anytime soon:wink: ) so Im not sure whats going to happen...
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Dam, Carlos. Just when I said I agreed with you, you come up with this one.

"Im just used to Chiefsplanet where no one bashes anybodys opinion, we disagree and try to base it on facts..."

I visit Chiefsplanet quite often and have seen the members trash other fans with little or no regard for feelings--just as some on this board do. To say that all of that board are polite and respectful is just not true:shakeno: . Let's be real, both boards are very similar.

Bigbucks
 
kcphantom said:
:redx: Who honestly thinks that Saban wont settle for something other than a second round pick for surtain? I think he will take the fourth that he was offered and then take another pick next year and that is to be determined on the performance of surtain whether it be a second or third.

But if you honestly think that he will get a second this year now that is funny:roflmao:
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Personally I think Nick should take nothing less than a 2nd, let KC sign a hobbled, less talented Law and smile twice a year when Moss goes for 200 plus against the Chiefs. That will teach their owner to be cheap
 
Bigbucks24 said:
Dam, Carlos. Just when I said I agreed with you, you come up with this one.

"Im just used to Chiefsplanet where no one bashes anybodys opinion, we disagree and try to base it on facts..."

I visit Chiefsplanet quite often and have seen the members trash other fans with little or no regard for feelings--just as some on this board do. To say that all of that board are polite and respectful is just not true:shakeno: . Let's be real, both boards are very similar.

Bigbucks
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:roflmao: :roflmao: :roflmao: I was kidding, your sarcastic meter must have been turned off... why do you think I started posting in this board... Anywhere you go you will find crazy fans that think this way, Chiefsplanet is probably worse than this board... Ive seen Miami fans come in and get torched, (for posting stupid remarks) If you posts fairly objectively you wont have issues... I was just saying that even though I was posting a fair opinion I was was being called ingnorant on this situation...

No biggie, maybe next time I will add smilies with my sarcasm....lol:wink:
 
LtDan662002 said:
Personally I think Nick should take nothing less than a 2nd, let KC sign a hobbled, less talented Law and smile twice a year when Moss goes for 200 plus against the Chiefs. That will teach their owner to be cheap
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He has been this way for 16 years, he wont change, he would say we were going for Law the whole time...:shakeno:
 
Difference here is that we do not need to make this deal now. We can wait. The chiefs are more at risk to lose out. If we do not get a deal on this, so what? we have a probowl CB still. End of story. The market will change if a deal is not done. The market will change because there will no longer be a draft to cause high anxiety to the market, which means, some team will asses their situation and know that Surtain will still be available for a deal. For those who have not given up on the trade for Alexander or Edge, you may end up with your wish when all is said and done.
 
W/ the rumours ref Minny and Tampa heating up, I'm really starting to wonder if Saban even trades Surtain.

I know we would take a financial hit, but both Nick and Pat have said that they would prefer Surtain remain a phin. Now, w/ the chance to gain picks in this years draft, it might be a situation wherein the ONLY issue whether Pat remains a phin is if they can work a cap friendly deal of some sort. KC may have gambled (that the fish would be desperate) and lost for the draft day deal.....anyone else think is even a possibility?

I would love to see Pat stay right where he is...we may not really care so much for the picks..even a second.
 
We will simply keep Surtain for another year.

How that can be done has already been explained numerous times by me and others in this thread.

We are not in a hurry, we can wait until next year. If we were "desperate' to get rid of Surtain it would have been done already.

Were not shipping off a PRO BOWL CORNER for a lousy 4th round pick.

Its not going to happen.
 
I agree there is no way we are going to trade Surtain for a 4th round pick. If the Chiefs think that they are crazy. That is not how you try to get a team better by trading pro bowl corners for 4th round picks. Now if Wanny was here maybe that would be he is way of doing it but thank god that idiot is gone!
 
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