Saban “I hate it...” | Page 10 | FinHeaven - Miami Dolphins Forums

Saban “I hate it...”

rent this space said:
Well I certainly don’t want a QB with those issues in the pros. The question is whether he can overcome once he gets there.
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Please be specific with your speculation lmao ...

JK ... Isn't that what coaches are supposed to do? ... help players with talent and potential maximize those things? ... It wouldn't be much fun if they were all pre=programmed robots ... talk about parity lol...

He has made it this far and has a decent track record ... he (or whomever) should be able to become acclimated for at least half a season ... Rosen still has not made a real appearance since the skins game ... we still don't know his progress (if any) ... We may be in better shape than we think
 
rent this space said:
look back about 10 posts
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TD/INT ratio would indicate that decision making is not as bad as you purport.

As far as progressions/reads, we really have no clue what coaches were asking him to do.

I'm not saying they are not issues, as it's possible they are. That's why teams interview/meet with players, so they can better assess the situation. Is the failing coachable, or inherrant? Is the perception accurate, or overblown?

Fans (and media), as a rule, have only a very small fraction of the info scouts/GMs do.

That being said, there is also the tried, and true "eyeball test". Does the guy have "IT"?

That answer varies, depending on who you ask.
 
Speculating... Free Agency first

1. This begins with the Offensive Line. So, Joe Thuney or Brandon Scherff, not both. Normally I would be unwilling to sign a Guard for 14 or 15 million per year, but with a young QB coming in we absolutely HAVE to give him protection... and since we are not paying a QB 30 mil/year right now, we can afford this. Thuney has been healthier than Scherff, so he's the pick. The Tackles in FA are either too old, or too injured, and will certainly be too expensive... so pass. The Center group is weak, and Kilgore is under contract for another year... pass.

2. Our pass rush was more of a pass lope... just awful. Must be addressed with multiple new players. A pass-rushing 3-4 Defensive End to start over Sieler and a replacement for Charles Harris is imperative. Not one or the other... BOTH. You can NEVER have too many pass rushers. This said, Free Agents from this area cost 15-20 million dollars per year and... tend to be less valuable as they age, frequently nicked up and largely useless as the season progresses. We could look at Clowney, Jones, Barret, Fowler, Dupree, Judon… even Williams, but unless one of these guys just falls in love with playing in Miami or for Flores, I'm probably going to pass and see what we can extricate from the draft. I'm not saying 'no', I'm saying probably not. Most of these guys are 27 and will probably slowing down about the time we are heating up. I'd be looking at guys like this in 2 years, not now.

3. DBs. I'm guessing that the X situation isn't as bad as some suspect. I saw one report that said she swung at him and then tripped over his crutch. If true... we placed him in storage this year because we wanted him fully healthy next year. I'm keeping him. Needham and some of the nickels looked pretty good, but we need a slot corner (perhaps McCain for now) and a safety to pair with Rowe. Considering the mileage we got out of a bunch of nobodies, I am not going to panic here. I'm going to sit down with Brandon Jones's agent and see how much it would take and if it could get done ,and if it could, I'd then be tempted to move X. Ultimately, I'd probably opt for a vet corner of lesser stature who could outplay McCain. Maybe Trae Waynes or Bradley Roby. Neither would come cheap... maybe 10 million/year. Signing players like this will punch a whole in that 100 million pretty quickly.

After that... I'd call it a day and wait until after the draft to look at the second chance guys who could be had on one year prove-it deals. Pretty dull... I know, but I'm not a believer in big Free Agent spending. Draft, develop and resign is the way to go.

Draft...

If Tua is on the board @ 5, I do my best to find a buyer and pick up a QB package of picks for selling his injury risk to someone else. If he's not, I sigh and then try to sell Herbert for a lesser package of picks. This draft is one of the deepest I have ever seen at Offensive Line and this is my #1 goal. More picks means more better... If I can find a way to grab 2 pass rushers early while still grabbing two starting Tackles and a Center in the first 70 picks... I'm going to be all over that.

I'd hope for something like this...

Espensesa, Kinlaw, or Derrick Brown, paired with my man crush, K'Lavon Chaisson with our first two picks.

Then I'd move on to whichever Tackles fell, knowing full well that the ones who fell would be top 15 most other year. I'd take two of them along with Eason, Fromm, or Love (pick your favourite) with our next three picks.

Following this, I'm looking Running Back and Safety. Maybe peeking at a Guard or Center in rounds 3 and 4. With all of the third day ammo that we have, this is the area where I start to think about trading up, rather than down. If our top rated Guard or Center... or WSLB or slot corner prospect has slid down into the bottom of the 3rd or 4th rounds. Make the move. Be aggressive; having three 5th rounders is nice, but the hit rate at this point is pretty low.

So... what would my perfect weekend look like?

OLT: Austin Jackson
OLG: Joe Thuney
C: Kilgore/Boehm/(rookie slider)
ORG: Davis/Dieter winner
ORT: Wanogho/Jones/Becton or Adams

RB: a new one

QB: Eason or Fromm

DE: Espenesa
DT: Wilkins
DT: Godchaux

SSLB: Chaisson
ILB: McMillian
ILB: Baker
WSLB: Van Ginkle/Strnad

CBs: X, Needham, Roby
Ss: Rowe, Ashtyn Davis or Antoine Winfield
 
Mach2 said:
TD/INT ratio would indicate that decision making is not as bad as you purport.

As far as progressions/reads, we really have no clue what coaches were asking him to do.

I'm not saying they are not issues, as it's possible they are. That's why teams interview/meet with players, so they can better assess the situation. Is the failing coachable, or inherrant? Is the perception accurate, or overblown?

Fans (and media), as a rule, have only a very small fraction of the info scouts/GMs do.

That being said, there is also the tried, and true "eyeball test". Does the guy have "IT"?

That answer varies, depending on who you ask.
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These aren’t my views, it’s just the first few draft profiles that came up in a google search. Please tell me you’re not concluding he makes good decisions based on a single stat
 
rent this space said:
These aren’t my views, it’s just the first few draft profiles that came up in a google search. Please tell me you’re not concluding he makes good decisions based on a single stat
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What are the draft profiles basing it on? Going to the (percieved) wrong reciever? Who has actual knowledge of the play design of any specific play, besides coaches and players?

The last time I had this conversation, I was told it was because he had a tendency for balls to "sail". I don't see that as a decision making issue.
 
Feverdream said:
So... what would my perfect weekend look like?

OLT: Austin Jackson
OLG: Joe Thuney
C: Kilgore/Boehm/(rookie slider)
ORG: Davis/Dieter winner
ORT: Wanogho/Jones/Becton or Adams

RB: a new one

QB: Eason or Fromm

DE: Espenesa
DT: Wilkins
DT: Godchaux

SSLB: Chaisson
ILB: McMillian
ILB: Baker
WSLB: Van Ginkle/Strnad

CBs: X, Needham, Roby
Ss: Rowe, Ashtyn Davis or Antoine Winfield
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Awesome speculation lol … seriously thanks for all the work you put into this … I like the approach … hope the new RB is a play maker and I would love to see a well rounded TE in the mix
 
Mach2 said:
What are the draft profiles basing it on? Going to the (percieved) wrong reciever? Who has actual knowledge of the play design of any specific play, besides coaches and players?

The last time I had this conversation, I was told it was because he had a tendency for balls to "sail". I don't see that as a decision making issue.
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I'm guessing these are rhetorical but I would think they are a bit more involved than guessing. I saw a couple people mention how the Oregon offense was primarily one-read and he tended to lock-on his primary target too much. Multiple reports said he stared-down receivers.
No one will ever accuse me of being a scout but I saw him in a few games this year and wasn't really impressed. To answer a previous question, he didn't seem to have "it".
His issues are not about physical ability, they seem to be between the ears. Some guys overcome that, many don't.
All that being said, I have also seen draft profiles that say his issues are correctable but he will need time.
 
Herbert seems to really change his game when hes facing tremendous pass rush. I love throwers who dont fall apart when pressure hits, which is ultimately the rarest skill, it appears.

For that reason alone I like Tua. And dont like Herbert. But the RESULT of that pressure... I want Herbert! Tua feels like Im buying a used car without the carfax.

So it's a damned if ya do, damned if ya dont situation. I struggle to see many teams willing to jump up to Miami's pick.

If the team that desperately that most notoriously needs a QB is wiling to hear offers, thats a bad sign.
 
I don’t know how anybody else feels about this but what about signing Kareem hunt for a 3 or 4 year deal?
 
Njfins87 said:
I don’t know how anybody else feels about this but what about signing Kareem hunt for a 3 or 4 year deal?
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I don't dislike the player, but I doubt he would accept any offer I would make.

I would want a team friendly out after year two.
 
Njfins87 said:
I don’t know how anybody else feels about this but what about signing Kareem hunt for a 3 or 4 year deal?
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I liked him in KC … not so much with the Browns .. not sure if it was because of his layoff or because it was the disfunction of the Browns,who, IMO did not live up to expectations with the roster they had ...
 
What if we still want Bridgewater.... he comes in with Rosen as a back up and Fitz hangs around as well … maybe Fitz retires and we pick up a QB in the 2nd? … not trying to :dead: … but there are things churning out there that will impact our draft decisions and selection at QB IMO …(Rivers, Newton, Brady and Brees) ( maybe Prescott and Carr too) … not to mention the changing of the guard in Washington NY, Carolina and Dallas ...

That would take the pressure off drafting a QB with a repaired broken hip and allow us to continue building … hell we may even get an offer we can't refuse at 5 …. :woot:

Does Teddy's game translate with a Gailey offense? :shrug: … I truly don't know

Would anyone be opposed? :munch:

I know the subject has been discussed in the forum … I know he turned us down last off season … but this is a speculation thread :lol:

With Brees staying put and Teddy getting older he would have a chance to prove himself a starter with new toys to play with .... :out:
 
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Njfins87 said:
I don’t know how anybody else feels about this but what about signing Kareem hunt for a 3 or 4 year deal?
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Mach2 said:
I don't dislike the player, but I doubt he would accept any offer I would make.

I would want a team friendly out after year two.
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Do we really want a FA RB? Even Derrick Henry would be risky IMO … RB's want to get paid with a short window to work with
 
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