Is Zo a hall of famer?

[finfansince72]

Mutombo had the same players ahead of him and Zo and yet he has more all-NBA selections and DPOY awards- is he a lock?


I think this poll says it all, on a Miami sports site where Zo is loved the voting is about even. If this vote was on a neutral board it would be overwhelmingly no.





he played as much as Shaq? Shaq played 210 mins in the finals, Zo played 66. In the postseason Zo averaged 3.8 PPG, 2.9 Rebs per game, 1 block per game- what would they have done w/o him? In the Finals Zo averaged a whopping 4.3 PPG, 3.1 Rebs per game, 1.5 blocks per game. How in the World could Miami have won w/o him?

Why do u keep bringing up Mutumbo? We all know he was a great defender but he couldnt throw the ball in the ocean. He will probaly make the ballot one day but he wont get in. Zo will. Your empassioned crapping aside, the voters will put him in. This boards vote means nothing, Id say half the board watches little to no real games. Im not a heat fan or a Zo fan but I think hes going to make it in easily. Look at the Hall, I mean guys that no ones heard of that lit up the league in Yugoslavia make it, college coaches that are mediocre make it, Zo will make it.

 

[Section126]

Mutombo had the same players ahead of him and Zo and yet he has more all-NBA selections and DPOY awards- is he a lock?


I think this poll says it all, on a Miami sports site where Zo is loved the voting is about even. If this vote was on a neutral board it would be overwhelmingly no.





he played as much as Shaq? Shaq played 210 mins in the finals, Zo played 66. In the postseason Zo averaged 3.8 PPG, 2.9 Rebs per game, 1 block per game- what would they have done w/o him? In the Finals Zo averaged a whopping 4.3 PPG, 3.1 Rebs per game, 1.5 blocks per game. How in the World could Miami have won w/o him?

Talk about using scewed numbers....

He had a torn calf to start the playoffs and had limited minutes.

He played the final 5 minutes in most of the games against NJ, Det, and Dallas.

If you didn;t watch the games..you just don't know how important he was to their title run.

As soon as he came in in those games...all drives to teh basket stopped. Hey..talking about stats...look at his +/- numbers on 82games.com during those playoffs.

It seemed as if every run the Heat made last year in the playoffs was with ZO on the court. the guy is a defensive force...at 400 years old no less.

 

[Section126]

They are 17-16 when Wade plays and when Shaq doesn't. The other guys are irrelevant but nice try to skew the #s.

.

The other guys are irrelevant?

So a stat that says that the Heat is 15-5 with J-Will and Wade (That was the stat at the time of that post) playing is meaningless? i think it means a helluva alot on a team that is under .500.


Just like last year...when the Nets were a .700 team with the big three healthy. a .300 team with any of the big three out.

 

[nyjunc]

Why do u keep bringing up Mutumbo? We all know he was a great defender but he couldnt throw the ball in the ocean. He will probaly make the ballot one day but he wont get in. Zo will. Your empassioned crapping aside, the voters will put him in. This boards vote means nothing, Id say half the board watches little to no real games. Im not a heat fan or a Zo fan but I think hes going to make it in easily. Look at the Hall, I mean guys that no ones heard of that lit up the league in Yugoslavia make it, college coaches that are mediocre make it, Zo will make it.

How does Zo make it and Mutombo does not? Mutombo made more all-NBA teams and won mroe big awards AND he led his team to maybe the biggest upset in playoff history in 1994.

The guys in Yugoslavia or what was Yougoslavia were great INt'l players- dominant. Zo was never a dominat player. The man got lucky he rode Shaq and Wade's coattails to a title b/c he proved he couldn't win one in a starring role whether it was in College where he had great teams and never even made a FF ro in the NBA where as a star he never made the Finals.

Talk about using scewed numbers....

He had a torn calf to start the playoffs and had limited minutes.

He played the final 5 minutes in most of the games against NJ, Det, and Dallas.

If you didn;t watch the games..you just don't know how important he was to their title run.

As soon as he came in in those games...all drives to teh basket stopped. Hey..talking about stats...look at his +/- numbers on 82games.com during those playoffs.

It seemed as if every run the Heat made last year in the playoffs was with ZO on the court. the guy is a defensive force...at 400 years old no less.

The key to the heat's title was Wade's ability to get to the FT line, they would have won it w/ or w/o Zo.

The other guys are irrelevant?

So a stat that says that the Heat is 15-5 with J-Will and Wade (That was the stat at the time of that post) playing is meaningless? i think it means a helluva alot on a team that is under .500.


Just like last year...when the Nets were a .700 team with the big three healthy. a .300 team with any of the big three out.

Carter, RJ and Kid are different from posey, Williams or whoever else. those are the Nets best players, it's like Miami losing Shaq and Wade. Losing those other guys is like losing a jason Collins.

 

[Section126]

Carter, RJ and Kid are different from posey, Williams or whoever else. those are the Nets best players, it's like Miami losing Shaq and Wade. Losing those other guys is like losing a jason Collins.

I understand that.

But I am talking about the stat.

A Stat that stark and stands out that prominently is rather important...no?

You have a team that is under .500...but somehow with this one guy (J-Will) along with Wade the team was 15-5.

 

[finfansince72]

How does Zo make it and Mutombo does not? Mutombo made more all-NBA teams and won mroe big awards AND he led his team to maybe the biggest upset in playoff history in 1994.

The guys in Yugoslavia or what was Yougoslavia were great INt'l players- dominant. Zo was never a dominat player. The man got lucky he rode Shaq and Wade's coattails to a title b/c he proved he couldn't win one in a starring role whether it was in College where he had great teams and never even made a FF ro in the NBA where as a star he never made the Finals.



The key to the heat's title was Wade's ability to get to the FT line, they would have won it w/ or w/o Zo.



Carter, RJ and Kid are different from posey, Williams or whoever else. those are the Nets best players, it's like Miami losing Shaq and Wade. Losing those other guys is like losing a jason Collins.

Again, Mutumbo doesnt belong in the discussion, he was a one way player. Making all NBA defense is great but you arent going to get into the Hall that way. Zo was a great player in his prime, bringing up the championship he won as though thats a slap against him is kinda stupid. As far as not winning one in his prime, lots of players have made the Hall without a ring, that doesnt even merit discussing. He put up huge numbers, played great defense and was a great player for a very long time. Hes going to get in, I dont doubt it. Im not sure why youre so upset about this and why u insist on dumping on the guy but youre going to be crying when he gets in.

 

[nyjunc]

Again, Mutumbo doesnt belong in the discussion, he was a one way player. Making all NBA defense is great but you arent going to get into the Hall that way. Zo was a great player in his prime, bringing up the championship he won as though thats a slap against him is kinda stupid. As far as not winning one in his prime, lots of players have made the Hall without a ring, that doesnt even merit discussing. He put up huge numbers, played great defense and was a great player for a very long time. Hes going to get in, I dont doubt it. Im not sure why youre so upset about this and why u insist on dumping on the guy but youre going to be crying when he gets in.

It's not that he couldn't lead his team to a Championship it's that he couldn't even get to the Finals, heck he only had 1 Finals appearance and that was b/c half the Knick team was suspended.

You can say mutombo was a 1 way player but how does he have more years as an all-NBA player? Mourning was a good to very good player, he was NEVER great. He's not a HOFer.

if he played such great defense why was he on an all-Defensive team just twice? (before you say Mutombo, there are 3 all-D teams just like the All-NBA teams)

Huge #s? When? For his career he has averaged 18 PPG, his career high was 23.2. Good #s yes but not huge #s. Only 4 years of his career did he average double digit rebounds. Where are these huge #s? he was top 10 in PPG just once and he finished 7th- where are these huge #s?

 

[UCFinfan86]

It's not that he couldn't lead his team to a Championship it's that he couldn't even get to the Finals, heck he only had 1 Finals appearance and that was b/c half the Knick team was suspended.

You can say mutombo was a 1 way player but how does he have more years as an all-NBA player? Mourning was a good to very good player, he was NEVER great. He's not a HOFer.

if he played such great defense why was he on an all-Defensive team just twice? (before you say Mutombo, there are 3 all-D teams just like the All-NBA teams)

Huge #s? When? For his career he has averaged 18 PPG, his career high was 23.2. Good #s yes but not huge #s. Only 4 years of his career did he average double digit rebounds. Where are these huge #s? he was top 10 in PPG just once and he finished 7th- where are these huge #s?

Shaq's highest PPG was 29.7. Only 6 pgg difference and Shaq is arguably the best C of all time.

Its alot harder for a C to average high 20's because they dont touch the ball everytime down the like court guards do.

I think that Zo should make the Hall, but barely. I don't believe he is a first ballot HOFer but i believe he should get in. He was a complete player.

 

[nyjunc]

Shaq's highest PPG was 29.7. Only 6 pgg difference and Shaq is arguably the best C of all time.

Its alot harder for a C to average high 20's because they dont touch the ball everytime down the like court guards do.

I think that Zo should make the Hall, but barely. I don't believe he is a first ballot HOFer but i believe he should get in. He was a complete player.

Shaq's career PPG is 26.3(3 points higher than Zo's best year). Ewing averaged in the high 20s, Olajuwon did, Robinson did, kareem did, Wilt did, Malone did. It's not all about scoring but that other psoter mentioned his "huge #s" and he never put up huge #s. He's not a HOFer, a very good player. A Brad Daugherty type, Actually I think Brad was better but his career was cut short.

 

[Section126]

Shaq's career PPG is 26.3(3 points higher than Zo's best year). Ewing averaged in the high 20s, Olajuwon did, Robinson did, kareem did, Wilt did, Malone did. It's not all about scoring but that other psoter mentioned his "huge #s" and he never put up huge #s. He's not a HOFer, a very good player. A Brad Daugherty type, Actually I think Brad was better but his career was cut short.

Like ZO's career wasn't cut short as well....:rolleyes2

ZO has a chance to make the all-star team this year...that would make him a 8 time all-star.

Name me how many 8 time-allstars are not in the HOF and won't make the HOF.


Basketball reference has him as a sure fire finalist. According to them...if he makes the All-Star team and is either 1st, 2nd or 3rd in blocks THIS SEASON...He is a lock to make the HALL.

If all he does is have this season and one more in the top 3 in blocks and production as a bench player that puts him in the top 25% of the league of bench players...he gets in.

http://www.databasebasketball.com/leaders/leadershof.htm

He will absolutely pass at least 10 CURRENT Hall Of Famers with his HOF Monitor score.

That means that at his current pace of just playing this season with his currrent productivity, he will have a higher HOF cume score than 10 CURRENT Hall of Famers.

In other words..he is getting in.

Sorry Nyjunc.

 

[nyjunc]

Like ZO's career wasn't cut short as well....:rolleyes2

ZO has a chance to make the all-star team this year...that would make him a 8 time all-star.

Name me how many 8 time-allstars are not in the HOF and won't make the HOF.


Basketball reference has him as a sure fire finalist. According to them...if he makes the All-Star team and is either 1st, 2nd or 3rd in blocks THIS SEASON...He is a lock to make the HALL.

If all he does is have this season and one more in the top 3 in blocks and production as a bench player that puts him in the top 25% of the league of bench players...he gets in.

http://www.databasebasketball.com/leaders/leadershof.htm

He will absolutely pass at least 10 CURRENT Hall Of Famers with his HOF Monitor score.

That means that at his current pace of just playing this season with his currrent productivity, he will have a higher HOF cume score than 10 CURRENT Hall of Famers.

In other words..he is getting in.

Sorry Nyjunc.

his career wasn't cut short, it was put on hold and he was already declining when that happened.

He is not making the ASG this year and the ASG has been a popularity contest.

vince carter has amde 7 ASGs and counting, do you think he'll be a HOFer?

Dikembe mutombo made 8(another area he beats Zo in yet he has no chance and Zo is a lock:rolleyes2 )

Larry Foust made 8

Artis gilmore 11(6 ABA but it's the basketball HOF not NBA HOF)

louie dampier 7

Grant Hill 7

Jack Sikma 7

Chet walker 7

JoJo White 7



basketball reference has him at .532 probablity, that's not going to get it done.

Zo was a good to very good player, never great. He's not a HOFer.

 

[nyjunc]

The link you gave: http://www.databasebasketball.com/leaders/leadershof.htm

Has Zo behind Mitch richmond, Horace Grant, Penny Hardaway, Chris Webber and you are using that as a guage to say Zo is a HOfer?

That means that at his current pace of just playing this season with his currrent productivity, he will have a higher HOF cume score than 10 CURRENT Hall of Famers.

He has a lower score of guys NOT in the HOF.

 

[Section126]

The link you gave: http://www.databasebasketball.com/leaders/leadershof.htm

Has Zo behind Mitch richmond, Horace Grant, Penny Hardaway, Chris Webber and you are using that as a guage to say Zo is a HOfer?



He has a lower score of guys NOT in the HOF.

DUDE..his career is not OVER!

He wins a DPOY award (contender)..he is a lock by Basketball references scores. He makes the All-Star team..it will be 8...not 7...as the list you provided had a bunch of 7 guys on there. But good job in reading my post.

The numbers on that site don't lie. His score will be higher than 10 current HOF's if he just keeps this pace.

 

[Section126]

his career wasn't cut short, it was put on hold and he was already declining when that happened.
.

Seriously...how do you type that stuff with a straight face?

Declining?

This is what he did his last season before being diagnosed with his problem:

21.7 ppg
9.5 rpg
3.7 bpg

All-Star.
Won the NBA Defensive Player of the Year.
Made All-Defensive First Team.
Third in the MVP voting.
All-NBA Second Team.

By making that statement of ZO being on the decline, I think you disqualify yourself from ever debating this issue. Your bias has seriously clouded your judgement to the point that you are inventing mythical "declines".

 

[nyjunc]

DUDE..his career is not OVER!

He wins a DPOY award (contender)..he is a lock by Basketball references scores. He makes the All-Star team..it will be 8...not 7...as the list you provided had a bunch of 7 guys on there. But good job in reading my post.

The numbers on that site don't lie. His score will be higher than 10 current HOF's if he just keeps this pace.

He's not winning a DPOY award and if he did why is he a lock when Mutombo isn't? he's not making the AS team. My lost had 7s ont here but also had guys up to 11 who aren't in the Hall.