Why is everyone caught up in Ryan Swope?

[Digital]

You are over exaggerating swopes' ability. He'll be a slot guy in the nfl and he is only 6'0". swope at the combine 40 and him on the field are 2 totally different running styles. You can see he practiced for the 40. Look at his tape, he runs wild on the field. It will slow him down. He won't be 4.3 fast in the nfl, definitely not in 3 to 4 years. He'll be good but, he isn't something we can't do without....... like a tall, fast red zone threat WR. swope ain't that.... But, if we get the big WR first, I'm all for adding swope.

I'd suggest watching Swope on tape again ... there are very few collegiate DB's that can catch him once he gets past them. I get your point about his playing speed not being as fast as his tested time, but for that to really kick in, you need to see him getting caught from behind on tape ... and you'll have to watch a lot of tape to find it, because it almost never happens. Sure, players with angles on him tackle him, because he was used primarily in the slot.

Sherman's offense features the slot receiver. It's the same offense he taught Philbin. It's the same offense Philbin ran in Green Bay, where Philbin had Greg Jennings primarily in the slot, because that is the feature position in this offense. Having a non-explosive player in the slot in this offense is suicide.

You mention Justin Hunter, and he is a very good WR. I do think that Hunter could play in the slot, but he's not really a slot receiver. He is the prototypical boundary wideout. He is fast enough to scare safeties deep, long enough to catch over DB's, and has excellent leaping and separating abilities to make him great running deep routes. What he lacks is strong hands for contested catches, physicality, durability and fearlessness. Those are qualities very beneficial to slot receivers. Sure, Hunter could play the position, but he's more useful at split end or flanker. Plus, he's going to be a 1st round pick, probably about a round before Swope, so you have to give up more resources to get him. Tavon Austin will be an early 1st, Justin Hunter a late 1st, and Ryan Swope will be a late 2nd. Austin and Hunter will require time to adjust and learn the playbook as well.

As for sizes, Davone Bess is only 5'8 and Ryan Swope is a little over 6'0 ... that's 4 inches difference, so I don't think I'm overstating it. It would be stretching it to call Bess 5'9, regardless of what he is listed as. But even if he were 5'9, that's a 3 inch difference.

As for him running wild. Count how many times he gets tackled from behind ... it'll be a short list.

 

[mbhcu98]

I'd suggest watching Swope on tape again ... there are very few collegiate DB's that can catch him once he gets past them. I get your point about his playing speed not being as fast as his tested time, but for that to really kick in, you need to see him getting caught from behind on tape ... and you'll have to watch a lot of tape to find it, because it almost never happens. Sure, players with angles on him tackle him, because he was used primarily in the slot.

Sherman's offense features the slot receiver. It's the same offense he taught Philbin. It's the same offense Philbin ran in Green Bay, where Philbin had Greg Jennings primarily in the slot, because that is the feature position in this offense. Having a non-explosive player in the slot in this offense is suicide.

You mention Justin Hunter, and he is a very good WR. I do think that Hunter could play in the slot, but he's not really a slot receiver. He is the prototypical boundary wideout. He is fast enough to scare safeties deep, long enough to catch over DB's, and has excellent leaping and separating abilities to make him great running deep routes. What he lacks is strong hands for contested catches, physicality, durability and fearlessness. Those are qualities very beneficial to slot receivers. Sure, Hunter could play the position, but he's more useful at split end or flanker. Plus, he's going to be a 1st round pick, probably about a round before Swope, so you have to give up more resources to get him. Tavon Austin will be an early 1st, Justin Hunter a late 1st, and Ryan Swope will be a late 2nd. Austin and Hunter will require time to adjust and learn the playbook as well.

As for sizes, Davone Bess is only 5'8 and Ryan Swope is a little over 6'0 ... that's 4 inches difference, so I don't think I'm overstating it. It would be stretching it to call Bess 5'9, regardless of what he is listed as. But even if he were 5'9, that's a 3 inch difference.

As for him running wild. Count how many times he gets tackled from behind ... it'll be a short list.

I hear you but, there are a lot of highlight reels out there. I don't know where to watch full games. No one h=gets caught from behind in a highlight reel. If there is tape of swope out there that's not just highlights, let me know where to find it. I have got my info from the couple games I've seen and his highlight reels. In those reels, where you don't see him get caught from behind, you see he has a sort of "wild" running style. His shoulders move back and forth and his feet look to be hitting the ground kinda hard. Look at Tavon Austim run though. He is fluid and can move. Swope does not provide what Austin does. @ different types of fast. I don't want Austin first either. I view them both as luxuries.

I can remember a bunch of WRs being the focus in Green Bay, not just one. That's the whole point of that offense. They throw it around to everyone. Randall Cobb played a lot of slot in GB also. They also threw it a lot to Jordy Nelson, James Jones, Jermichael Finley and Donald Driver. Actually Jennings has missed a bunch of games and played hurt a lot the last 2 years. ALL WRs ARE STAPLES IN THE GB OFFENSE.

We don't need a slot WR, we have one... Bess and he is one of the better slot guys in the league. We need a deep threat that go up and get the ball in the red zone. That is exactly what Hunter is. The strong hands thing can be learned. We need the guy that can go and get it over a smaller DBs(which most dbs are to hunter). Bess and Gibson are good enough for our slot spot. With Hunter, hartline can even go inside some, especially in the red zone. WE DON'T NEED SWOPE OR AUSTIN. We do need what Hunter brings.

So, bess may not be listed right but, swope is? How do you know he is a legit 6'0"? You don't but, you comment as you do to fit your argument. Even at 6'0", swope can't be the red zone threat we need. He is a luxury, just like Austin.

---------- Post added at 06:26 PM ---------- Previous post was at 06:25 PM ----------

I'd suggest watching Swope on tape again ... there are very few collegiate DB's that can catch him once he gets past them. I get your point about his playing speed not being as fast as his tested time, but for that to really kick in, you need to see him getting caught from behind on tape ... and you'll have to watch a lot of tape to find it, because it almost never happens. Sure, players with angles on him tackle him, because he was used primarily in the slot.

Sherman's offense features the slot receiver. It's the same offense he taught Philbin. It's the same offense Philbin ran in Green Bay, where Philbin had Greg Jennings primarily in the slot, because that is the feature position in this offense. Having a non-explosive player in the slot in this offense is suicide.

You mention Justin Hunter, and he is a very good WR. I do think that Hunter could play in the slot, but he's not really a slot receiver. He is the prototypical boundary wideout. He is fast enough to scare safeties deep, long enough to catch over DB's, and has excellent leaping and separating abilities to make him great running deep routes. What he lacks is strong hands for contested catches, physicality, durability and fearlessness. Those are qualities very beneficial to slot receivers. Sure, Hunter could play the position, but he's more useful at split end or flanker. Plus, he's going to be a 1st round pick, probably about a round before Swope, so you have to give up more resources to get him. Tavon Austin will be an early 1st, Justin Hunter a late 1st, and Ryan Swope will be a late 2nd. Austin and Hunter will require time to adjust and learn the playbook as well.

As for sizes, Davone Bess is only 5'8 and Ryan Swope is a little over 6'0 ... that's 4 inches difference, so I don't think I'm overstating it. It would be stretching it to call Bess 5'9, regardless of what he is listed as. But even if he were 5'9, that's a 3 inch difference.

As for him running wild. Count how many times he gets tackled from behind ... it'll be a short list.

And if Hunter lacks all of this, why is he a 2nd round pick while Swope is a 3rd or 4th rounder?

 

[J. David Wannyheimer]

Let's see, the guy is fast, has good size, good hands, PLAYS PHYSICAL, and already knows Mike Sherman's offense and how he and Ryan Tannehill are expected to play in that offense.

No brainer in the 2nd round, IMO. Watch him play, he makes tough catches and is a very good athlete. The only thing that scares me is the concussion history.

I'm all for drafting Austin and Swope. Somebody is going to replace Davone Bess and Brandon Gibson does nothing for me.

 

[yolli71]

I hear you but, there are a lot of highlight reels out there. I don't know where to watch full games. No one h=gets caught from behind in a highlight reel. If there is tape of swope out there that's not just highlights, let me know where to find it. I have got my info from the couple games I've seen and his highlight reels. In those reels, where you don't see him get caught from behind, you see he has a sort of "wild" running style. His shoulders move back and forth and his feet look to be hitting the ground kinda hard. Look at Tavon Austim run though. He is fluid and can move. Swope does not provide what Austin does. @ different types of fast. I don't want Austin first either. I view them both as luxuries.

I can remember a bunch of WRs being the focus in Green Bay, not just one. That's the whole point of that offense. They throw it around to everyone. Randall Cobb played a lot of slot in GB also. They also threw it a lot to Jordy Nelson, James Jones, Jermichael Finley and Donald Driver. Actually Jennings has missed a bunch of games and played hurt a lot the last 2 years. ALL WRs ARE STAPLES IN THE GB OFFENSE.

We don't need a slot WR, we have one... Bess and he is one of the better slot guys in the league. We need a deep threat that go up and get the ball in the red zone. That is exactly what Hunter is. The strong hands thing can be learned. We need the guy that can go and get it over a smaller DBs(which most dbs are to hunter). Bess and Gibson are good enough for our slot spot. With Hunter, hartline can even go inside some, especially in the red zone. WE DON'T NEED SWOPE OR AUSTIN. We do need what Hunter brings.

So, bess may not be listed right but, swope is? How do you know he is a legit 6'0"? You don't but, you comment as you do to fit your argument. Even at 6'0", swope can't be the red zone threat we need. He is a luxury, just like Austin.

---------- Post added at 06:26 PM ---------- Previous post was at 06:25 PM ----------

And if Hunter lacks all of this, why is he a 2nd round pick while Swope is a 3rd or 4th rounder?

I agree with a lot of what you say, but one thing I absolutely do not agree with is "strong hands can be learned." It can't. That is an innate, natural ability thing. You can improve your hands, but you can't make them great or strong. I don't want anyone who doesn't have really good hands...I was sick and tired of watching Brandon Marshall drop pass after pass. If you're worried about red zone or size, draft Eifert first and then draft Swope later. I'd be happy w/ this, but my first choice would probably be Austin and then someone like Ertz, Escobar, or Kelce (who can also block). I agree that Austin is a luxury, but with Austin and Wallace and Keller and Miller on the field...are you F'ing kidding me? That will be a matchup nightmare for opposing D's! Austin's presence alone will make D's switch up how they defend Miami's O.

 

[mbhcu98]

Let's see, the guy is fast, has good size, good hands, PLAYS PHYSICAL, and already knows Mike Sherman's offense and how he and Ryan Tannehill are expected to play in that offense.

No brainer in the 2nd round, IMO. Watch him play, he makes tough catches and is a very good athlete. The only thing that scares me is the concussion history.

I'm all for drafting Austin and Swope. Somebody is going to replace Davone Bess and Brandon Gibson does nothing for me.

Both are luxuries we don't need. Austin may actually give us something we don't already have. Swpoe will not. Between Bess, Gibson snd hartline, we have what swope will give us already. Our WRs are good but, we are missing one piece and it isn't a 6'0" WR with a 4.3 but, can't be a red zone threat. The only thing we need in a WR is a target when we are down in the red zone. Swope isn't that. Is he?

 

[Digital]

I hear you but, there are a lot of highlight reels out there. I don't know where to watch full games. No one h=gets caught from behind in a highlight reel. If there is tape of swope out there that's not just highlights, let me know where to find it. I have got my info from the couple games I've seen and his highlight reels. In those reels, where you don't see him get caught from behind, you see he has a sort of "wild" running style. His shoulders move back and forth and his feet look to be hitting the ground kinda hard. Look at Tavon Austim run though. He is fluid and can move. Swope does not provide what Austin does. @ different types of fast. I don't want Austin first either. I view them both as luxuries.

I can remember a bunch of WRs being the focus in Green Bay, not just one. That's the whole point of that offense. They throw it around to everyone. Randall Cobb played a lot of slot in GB also. They also threw it a lot to Jordy Nelson, James Jones, Jermichael Finley and Donald Driver. Actually Jennings has missed a bunch of games and played hurt a lot the last 2 years. ALL WRs ARE STAPLES IN THE GB OFFENSE.

We don't need a slot WR, we have one... Bess and he is one of the better slot guys in the league. We need a deep threat that go up and get the ball in the red zone. That is exactly what Hunter is. The strong hands thing can be learned. We need the guy that can go and get it over a smaller DBs(which most dbs are to hunter). Bess and Gibson are good enough for our slot spot. With Hunter, hartline can even go inside some, especially in the red zone. WE DON'T NEED SWOPE OR AUSTIN. We do need what Hunter brings.

So, bess may not be listed right but, swope is? How do you know he is a legit 6'0"? You don't but, you comment as you do to fit your argument. Even at 6'0", swope can't be the red zone threat we need. He is a luxury, just like Austin.

---------- Post added at 06:26 PM ---------- Previous post was at 06:25 PM ----------



And if Hunter lacks all of this, why is he a 2nd round pick while Swope is a 3rd or 4th rounder?

Well I guess I've had the benefit of watching Swope over the years, but gauge the speeds he runs by the DB's speeds and he's always as fast or faster. Then match him up with solid competition and you'll gain an appreciation for his speed. That's the best I can say, because there aren't a lot of full games on youtube or freely downloadable.

I actually agree with you that Tavon Austin's playing speed is faster than Swope's. But, he's the fastest top player at a major college level in this draft. There are a couple of kids from Texas and a few others spread around that are also blazing fast, but none of the major players on a team in a major conference really. Austin proved faster than every defensive player he faced all year. He was also insanely quick with tremendous burst and change of direction. I'm not saying Swope has all that. What I am saying is that Swope is also faster than almost every defensive player he faced, and he also has tremendous explosion.

The 40 yard dash measures multiple things together:
1. Starting burst
2. Acceleration
3. Top Speed
4. Technique

Bad technique can really hurt your score, but very few prospects have truly bad technique. The kid Marquise Goodwin from Texas is on the track team, so he had great technique, but even that showed he was running very closely with Tavon Austin the entire way, and the technique is probably what put him over the top. On the field Tavon Austin looked--to me--slightly quicker and possibly faster. Even assuming Swope doesn't have that phenomenal starting burst and change of direction that Tavon Austin does, you have to admit that he either made up time with his acceleration or his top speed. Acceleration is separation on medium routes. Top speed is what scares safeties back and separates on deep routes. But, the 40 time is just one measure of explosion.

The most used other measures of explosion are the vertical jump, where Swope jumped a phenomenal 37 inches. Your suggestion of Justin Hunter was great, as he posted the highest vertical at the combine of 39.5 inches. At his pro day he jumped 40.5 inches ... and he was an international caliber high jumper. But any way you look at it, 37 inches is tremendously explosive. Another measure is the broad jump, where he also excelled. Quickness and change of direction are harder to measure IMHO, but the tests for them tend to be the 3 cone drill and the short shuttle, both of which Swope did very well in also.

I listed some things that Justin Hunter didn't have, but let's be clear, I've been a huge Justin Hunter fan for a long time, and prior to the season was hoping we'd get him in the draft with our first pick. But he's an AJ Green type receiver, an outside receiver. Even with his flaws, his size, length, insane leaping ability and 4.44 speed means he'll go in the first round. He'll just take a little while to develop. But, he could become an AJ Green type of player on the outside. With Wallace and Hartline, we will not select Hunter or Patterson in the 1st.

I agree with you though, for judging bust ultimately you need to look at the tape, as quickness in under-armor isn't the same as quickness in football pads. And I also agree that Swope's run style looks funky, as he does swing his arm kinda wildly. But, don't let that detract from watching him run, because he's gliding past people rather effortlessly from the waist down. It's only the upper body that looks funky. And, he pulls away from DB's consistently.

Hunter is a 1st round WR in my eyes and I'll be surprised if he falls out of the 1st even with this great depth in the WR class. Swope is a 2nd rounder. Why? Because Swope is 6'0 and Hunter is 6'4 with longer arms and 3 inch higher vertical. It doesn't matter how much higher than a DB Calvin Johnson goes ... if he gets above the DB and catches a TD pass, it's 6 points. If Calvin Johnson were 6'0 instead of 6'4, Calvin Johnson would be Andre Johnson's little brother.

 

[mbhcu98]

Well I guess I've had the benefit of watching Swope over the years, but gauge the speeds he runs by the DB's speeds and he's always as fast or faster. Then match him up with solid competition and you'll gain an appreciation for his speed. That's the best I can say, because there aren't a lot of full games on youtube or freely downloadable.

I actually agree with you that Tavon Austin's playing speed is faster than Swope's. But, he's the fastest top player at a major college level in this draft. There are a couple of kids from Texas and a few others spread around that are also blazing fast, but none of the major players on a team in a major conference really. Austin proved faster than every defensive player he faced all year. He was also insanely quick with tremendous burst and change of direction. I'm not saying Swope has all that. What I am saying is that Swope is also faster than almost every defensive player he faced, and he also has tremendous explosion.

The 40 yard dash measures multiple things together:
1. Starting burst
2. Acceleration
3. Top Speed
4. Technique

Bad technique can really hurt your score, but very few prospects have truly bad technique. The kid Marquise Goodwin from Texas is on the track team, so he had great technique, but even that showed he was running very closely with Tavon Austin the entire way, and the technique is probably what put him over the top. On the field Tavon Austin looked--to me--slightly quicker and possibly faster. Even assuming Swope doesn't have that phenomenal starting burst and change of direction that Tavon Austin does, you have to admit that he either made up time with his acceleration or his top speed. Acceleration is separation on medium routes. Top speed is what scares safeties back and separates on deep routes. But, the 40 time is just one measure of explosion.

The most used other measures of explosion are the vertical jump, where Swope jumped a phenomenal 37 inches. Your suggestion of Justin Hunter was great, as he posted the highest vertical at the combine of 39.5 inches. At his pro day he jumped 40.5 inches ... and he was an international caliber high jumper. But any way you look at it, 37 inches is tremendously explosive. Another measure is the broad jump, where he also excelled. Quickness and change of direction are harder to measure IMHO, but the tests for them tend to be the 3 cone drill and the short shuttle, both of which Swope did very well in also.

I listed some things that Justin Hunter didn't have, but let's be clear, I've been a huge Justin Hunter fan for a long time, and prior to the season was hoping we'd get him in the draft with our first pick. But he's an AJ Green type receiver, an outside receiver. Even with his flaws, his size, length, insane leaping ability and 4.44 speed means he'll go in the first round. He'll just take a little while to develop. But, he could become an AJ Green type of player on the outside. With Wallace and Hartline, we will not select Hunter or Patterson in the 1st.

I agree with you though, for judging bust ultimately you need to look at the tape, as quickness in under-armor isn't the same as quickness in football pads. And I also agree that Swope's run style looks funky, as he does swing his arm kinda wildly. But, don't let that detract from watching him run, because he's gliding past people rather effortlessly from the waist down. It's only the upper body that looks funky. And, he pulls away from DB's consistently.

Hunter is a 1st round WR in my eyes and I'll be surprised if he falls out of the 1st even with this great depth in the WR class. Swope is a 2nd rounder. Why? Because Swope is 6'0 and Hunter is 6'4 with longer arms and 3 inch higher vertical. It doesn't matter how much higher than a DB Calvin Johnson goes ... if he gets above the DB and catches a TD pass, it's 6 points. If Calvin Johnson were 6'0 instead of 6'4, Calvin Johnson would be Andre Johnson's little brother.

I guess I'm just saying we don't need Swope or Austin. They would be nice to have and would give the offense aother level(Austin moreso) but, I like our WRs now. Just think we need a big WR to handle the red zone for us. I watched swope 2 maybe 3 times last year and about 3 times the season before. He stood out a lot. After we build our team, I would love to add Austin or Swope.

I don't think Hunter will go in the 1st. He's looking like a 2nd rounder now. He is the 2nd Tenn WR right now and Corrdarelle may even slip into the 2nd(doubt it).

I didn't know Swope jumped 37 inches. He's a better athlete than I am giving him credit for but, we just don't need him right now and he is still only 6'0". And I don't think swope is as fast, on the field, as his 40 time suggests, he didn't "LOOK" the same as when he is on the field and he isn't outrunning too many NFL DBs. Do you see his athleticism staying at the level it is at now for say 5 years? I don't think he will be the type of WR, in the NFL that will even utilize his speed at it's full effectiveness. His route running, technique and separation he makes are going to serve him much more than his speed will, especially playing where he'll play, the slot.

 

[King Dingaling]

Swope is exactly what we should be looking for. Smart, athletic, 4.3 speed, and very productive in Sherman's offense. Great chemistry with Tannehill is also a plus. He had 2120 yds and 21 TDs in his final 2 years and is A&M's all-time reception leader!!! He's not a 1st round pick and could be available in the 3rd. He would be a younger, cheaper, and potentially better version of Bess. What is it we're not supposed to like about him again???

 

[J. David Wannyheimer]

Both are luxuries we don't need.

I disagree, I think the team's inability to score touchdowns and produce YAC in 2012 speaks for itself. And I don't think one player remedies that lousy situation.

 

[Digital]

I guess I'm just saying we don't need Swope or Austin. They would be nice to have and would give the offense aother level(Austin moreso) but, I like our WRs now. Just think we need a big WR to handle the red zone for us. I watched swope 2 maybe 3 times last year and about 3 times the season before. He stood out a lot. After we build our team, I would love to add Austin or Swope.

I don't think Hunter will go in the 1st. He's looking like a 2nd rounder now. He is the 2nd Tenn WR right now and Corrdarelle may even slip into the 2nd(doubt it).

I didn't know Swope jumped 37 inches. He's a better athlete than I am giving him credit for but, we just don't need him right now and he is still only 6'0". And I don't think swope is as fast, on the field, as his 40 time suggests, he didn't "LOOK" the same as when he is on the field and he isn't outrunning too many NFL DBs. Do you see his athleticism staying at the level it is at now for say 5 years? I don't think he will be the type of WR, in the NFL that will even utilize his speed at it's full effectiveness. His route running, technique and separation he makes are going to serve him much more than his speed will, especially playing where he'll play, the slot.

Your point about needing a red zone target is a good one. I've been pounding that point home in lots of threads around here and am totally on-board with ya on that one. My thought is that we absolutely need at least 1 big length/lift guy in the red zone, preferably 2. My thought was that Tyler Eifert would be great at this. He is 2 inches taller but not really any more of a vertical threat than Hunter, but Eifert is a tremendous catcher in traffic, and bodies away any of those thin DB's that can jump with him. I even stated months ago that my dream scenario would be to trade down (with Cincinnati or now Minnesota) to trade down from #12 and up from #42 to grab both Eifert and Hunter. If we gave up #12 and #42 and got Minnesota's #23 and #25 we would have a good shot at getting both of them. But, I doubt we'll be able to convince Minnesota to make that trade, it's no certainty that Eifert will still be there, and it doesn't appear that our front office wants to draft another boundary WR like Hunter that high. But, he has too much raw ability to slide into the 2nd round I think. Back when everyone was drooling over Keenan Allen and Robert Woods, I was steadfast in saying that the best 2 WR's in this draft are the two kids from Tennessee, Patterson and Hunter. It's not really clear which of the two is better in the long run, but both have tremendous potential and production.

Don't sweat underselling Swope. The kid holds the record for most catches at Texas A&M, but because he was a white slot receiver, everyone just assumed he wasn't fast, wasn't explosive, and wasn't very good. Much the way Jordy Nelsen blew past people for TD's for the first couple of years he was actually playing for Green Bay. The DB's simply refused to believe that the white kid was faster than them, and when they realized they were wrong, it was too late to catch him. On the other hand, Swope played in the slot, and as a former running back was bulkier than most WR's. His gliding running style coupled with his swinging arm motion made him look less fast. But once you get past that, you notice him running faster than the DB's, bouncing around would-be tacklers, and generally wreaking havoc in space. He also has enough power to break through many arm tackles, so those poorer tackling DB's will really not like him. He may not be Tavon Austin in space, but he definitely can be Randall Cobb in the slot. That would be a fantastic 2nd round pick IMHO.

 

[enigmatics]

See: Best, Jahvid, and Collie, Austin.

Not to mention those players were more talented. The league is moving to a system of independent neurological analysis that's going to end up retiring Swope as it effectively has those two players, possibly even before he reveals himself to be overrated. But even if he ends up being another Victor Cruz it won't matter if he's stumbling around on the sideline muttering that he's Batman.

There's a reason Tavon Austin doesn't have concussion issues, people. It's not just luck. It's because he has elite vision and quickness. You can't get a clean shot on him, therefore you can't hurt him. It's not unlike Barry Sanders, who never had a major injury in his career. Swope has nothing approaching those physical skills or dynamic vision and plays a reckless style with a body that can't stand the pounding. The results have been and will continue to be utterly predictable.

If Swope were really a valid replacement he wouldn't have these kinds of problems. But he does. And that in itself should tell you something.

Thank you for bringing up Best and Collie. Been saying the same thing. With a concussion history like Swope's had in college, he's going to have a short NFL career. The hits are only going to be bigger.

 

[mbhcu98]

I hear you but, there are a lot of highlight reels out there. I don't know where to watch full games. No one h=gets caught from behind in a highlight reel. If there is tape of swope out there that's not just highlights, let me know where to find it. I have got my info from the couple games I've seen and his highlight reels. In those reels, where you don't see him get caught from behind, you see he has a sort of "wild" running style. His shoulders move back and forth and his feet look to be hitting the ground kinda hard. Look at Tavon Austim run though. He is fluid and can move. Swope does not provide what Austin does. @ different types of fast. I don't want Austin first either. I view them both as luxuries.

I can remember a bunch of WRs being the focus in Green Bay, not just one. That's the whole point of that offense. They throw it around to everyone. Randall Cobb played a lot of slot in GB also. They also threw it a lot to Jordy Nelson, James Jones, Jermichael Finley and Donald Driver. Actually Jennings has missed a bunch of games and played hurt a lot the last 2 years. ALL WRs ARE STAPLES IN THE GB OFFENSE.

We don't need a slot WR, we have one... Bess and he is one of the better slot guys in the league. We need a deep threat that go up and get the ball in the red zone. That is exactly what Hunter is. The strong hands thing can be learned. We need the guy that can go and get it over a smaller DBs(which most dbs are to hunter). Bess and Gibson are good enough for our slot spot. With Hunter, hartline can even go inside some, especially in the red zone. WE DON'T NEED SWOPE OR AUSTIN. We do need what Hunter brings.

So, bess may not be listed right but, swope is? How do you know he is a legit 6'0"? You don't but, you comment as you do to fit your argument. Even at 6'0", swope can't be the red zone threat we need. He is a luxury, just like Austin.

---------- Post added at 06:26 PM ---------- Previous post was at 06:25 PM ----------



I agree with a lot of what you say, but one thing I absolutely do not agree with is "strong hands can be learned." It can't. That is an innate, natural ability thing. You can improve your hands, but you can't make them great or strong. I don't want anyone who doesn't have really good hands...I was sick and tired of watching Brandon Marshall drop pass after pass. If you're worried about red zone or size, draft Eifert first and then draft Swope later. I'd be happy w/ this, but my first choice would probably be Austin and then someone like Ertz, Escobar, or Kelce (who can also block). I agree that Austin is a luxury, but with Austin and Wallace and Keller and Miller on the field...are you F'ing kidding me? That will be a matchup nightmare for opposing D's! Austin's presence alone will make D's switch up how they defend Miami's O.

Strong hands can be learned. Just like strong arms or legs. Moreso being built than learned but, a weakness can always become a positive if you work on it, when it comes to strength. How has Marshall looked since leaving Miami? Marshall would've been a good WR, ON THE FIELD, for Tannehill. I love Eifert and want him badly. If we only have Eifert in the red zone it's no secret where we want to go. I want Justin Hunter before Austin or Swope. I don't see Swope scoring many TDs in the NFL. Austin will and I'd rather have him than Swope but, I don't want us to use our 1st on him so, we have no chance at getting him, since we'd need to use our 1st to get him. Austin is on anpother level than Swope though. I wouldn't be upset if we drafted him, I just think we need to build foundation first and I view Austin as a luxury. Percy Harvin is going to be a beast in Seattle and he may actually be the tipping point for them. He was just a great player on a Vikings team that would win nothing. He was great last year but, they still won without him when he got hurt. He was a luxury that wasn't going to help them win. Now, Seattle is already a good team. Harvin will put them over the top. We aren't there yet. Austin reminds me a lot of the type of player that Harvin is. He was a luxury that wouldn't help Minn win because they were not set in their foundation. Seattle is and are getting ready to have an explosive season. They are adding this luxury to an already stable team. We ain't them........... yet.

 

[mbhcu98]

Your point about needing a red zone target is a good one. I've been pounding that point home in lots of threads around here and am totally on-board with ya on that one. My thought is that we absolutely need at least 1 big length/lift guy in the red zone, preferably 2. My thought was that Tyler Eifert would be great at this. He is 2 inches taller but not really any more of a vertical threat than Hunter, but Eifert is a tremendous catcher in traffic, and bodies away any of those thin DB's that can jump with him. I even stated months ago that my dream scenario would be to trade down (with Cincinnati or now Minnesota) to trade down from #12 and up from #42 to grab both Eifert and Hunter. If we gave up #12 and #42 and got Minnesota's #23 and #25 we would have a good shot at getting both of them. But, I doubt we'll be able to convince Minnesota to make that trade, it's no certainty that Eifert will still be there, and it doesn't appear that our front office wants to draft another boundary WR like Hunter that high. But, he has too much raw ability to slide into the 2nd round I think. Back when everyone was drooling over Keenan Allen and Robert Woods, I was steadfast in saying that the best 2 WR's in this draft are the two kids from Tennessee, Patterson and Hunter. It's not really clear which of the two is better in the long run, but both have tremendous potential and production.

Don't sweat underselling Swope. The kid holds the record for most catches at Texas A&M, but because he was a white slot receiver, everyone just assumed he wasn't fast, wasn't explosive, and wasn't very good. Much the way Jordy Nelsen blew past people for TD's for the first couple of years he was actually playing for Green Bay. The DB's simply refused to believe that the white kid was faster than them, and when they realized they were wrong, it was too late to catch him. On the other hand, Swope played in the slot, and as a former running back was bulkier than most WR's. His gliding running style coupled with his swinging arm motion made him look less fast. But once you get past that, you notice him running faster than the DB's, bouncing around would-be tacklers, and generally wreaking havoc in space. He also has enough power to break through many arm tackles, so those poorer tackling DB's will really not like him. He may not be Tavon Austin in space, but he definitely can be Randall Cobb in the slot. That would be a fantastic 2nd round pick IMHO.

Yeah, that running style will be less effective n the NFL. Records in college mean very little. Doesn't Ryan Leaf still hold a bunch of records at WSU? Andre Ware at Houston? Tebow at Florida? J. Russell at LSU? Those records only meat something in college. They mean nothing now.

Randal Cobb is actually a good comparison but there a few differences that will be exposed in the nfl. Cobb has a better and more fluid running style. His acceleration is much better. Cobb doesn't look like he has to "START" running. He just looks like he is running as soon as he takes off. He has more moves than Swope too. Swope is good in the open field tho and takes a hit better than Cobb. That's where being a former RB comes in but, Cobb runs more smoothly. Also please understand who Nelson has throwing him the ball and remember, in GBs system, no one WR dominates. Nelson is a bad mutha- f*ck* tho(sorry) but, he is much different than Swope. Swope will be inside, Nelson is outside where that speed can be taken advantage of better. I see Swope being somewhere like Cobb but, won't score too many TDs, more like Welker though. Somewhere in between. He'll be good, we just need his good right now. I feel his speed won't get noticed much in the nfl, he will but, his speed won't. The difference between Swope and Austin is this, IMO, Austin can go to a team with bad WRs and still be very effective. Swope will need to go to a team who has a pretty stable set of WRs to be as effective as he can be. Swope or Austin are not #1 WRs(both slot guys) but, Austins' numbers have a chance to be comparable from the slot. I don't think Swope will score many TDs. Will be a very effective WR but, more of a chains mover.

 

[Geforce]

As for sizes, Davone Bess is only 5'8 and Ryan Swope is a little over 6'0 ... that's 4 inches difference, so I don't think I'm overstating it. It would be stretching it to call Bess 5'9, regardless of what he is listed as. But even if he were 5'9, that's a 3 inch difference.

WOW! Bess can't catch a break these days. It's one thing to want to get rid of him now we are saying he's shorter than he actually is?

 

[dcnr226]

I disagree, I think the team's inability to score touchdowns and produce YAC in 2012 speaks for itself. And I don't think one player remedies that lousy situation.

100% agree. Eifert finishes this offense. Running back that JUST GETS POSITIVE production. Wide receivers that work deep, intermediate, short. Receiving TE in Keller, do it all TE in Eifert