Armando: players take on Tua | Page 7 | FinHeaven - Miami Dolphins Forums

Armando: players take on Tua

He’s got it, no doubt. Boy, hate or draft night but Sewell and some toys would make me happy at game 1
 
jazz015 said:
I mean Gailey saying he had to scrap his notes on coverages and have assistant help him with what he was seeing was interesting. I wouldn't of cared for keeping it simple but the fact he was caught off guard that defenses adjusted to them was annoying. I see why he was unemployed.

Tua needs a system like new Orleans or San Fran. He could thrive in an offense designed around reads and attacking weaknesses. He is much smarter and talented than goff/Jimmy g. He just needs consistency and more help from thr skill positions to develop.

Letting geriatric OCs favor veterans and switching OCs every year isn't an ideal recipe moving forward
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yeah the notes stuff is like you got to be shitting me

Surprised he even said it actually. Makes you look utterly incompetent
 
Of course the quotes are real I don’t put much merit into them no one elevated their game more than half of the so called skill positions were forever injured or listed injured

The players will be sifted thru and thru that is what a purge/tank/rebuild is

There isn’t one Skill player who shouldn’t be looking over their shoulder this off season
 
SO:

  • Tua looked timid and unimpressive in several games
  • Tua looked good in a couple games
  • Tua looked very much like the future of the franchise in a couple games
  • Tua has not convinced "at least a handful of players" that he should be the guaranteed starter in 2021
  • Tua was a rookie coming off a major injury
  • Tua did not have very good weapons at his disposal
  • Tua didn't do as much as he could have with the weapons he had at his disposal, for whatever reason.
Here's the thing: ALL OF THE ABOVE CAN BE TRUE.

Nobody on this board knows how Tua's going to turn out. Does he have elite arm strength or running ability? No. We already knew that. But they certainly appear to be good enough to succeed.

Is there something to this story? I think so. And I can understand why WR would be disappointed in Tua as opposed to Fitz; Fitz makes them look better. He's a gunslinger who was considerably more comfortable in and familiar with Gailey's system, and he pushed the ball downfield.

However:

1) I trust Flores more than anyone who's been in the Dolphins organization for decades. He's building a team, which is more important than any individual player. Tua is currently the most important piece of that, but I trust Flores to determine if Tua's the guy to lead the team to the next level.

2) There's something to be said for the prospect of giving Tua the reins AND weapons in 2021. 9 games simply isn't enough to evaluate a QB, particularly on a team in year 2 of a rebuild. Is a year and 9 games enough? Maybe...and I think Flores/Grier will certainly know for sure, because they're smart enough to put Tua in the best position to succeed.

3) The guy we might be discounting the most is Tua himself. All the kid has done since he was young is work on his shortcomings. He finds out what he's doing wrong, and he fixes it. I'm not pushing the panic button yet, and neither should anyone here. The writing isn't on the wall. We haven't seen all we ned to see. There's just no "I told you so" stuff yet.

Fins up.
 
BigNastyFish said:
I expected a LOT better. That's at least what I'd hoped for. The kid looked and played small way too much.

Lot's of limitations (size, athleticism, arm) that are just intrinsic. Can the kid become "great?" I guess it's possible.

But I have no clue what his "greatness" is going to be based on right now. So IMO it's a long shot.

If you're honest and strip away the hype and rah rah coming from college -- and imagine he was from

some no name school and a mid round pick -- NO ONE would be making these grand claims about the kid

after what he produced this year on the field. Tells me the support is based on myth and not fact.
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WTH is playing too small? If he looked slow, or was fearful to climb or escape the pocket for multiple first downs and TD's I'd agree, but that wasn't the case. He did a great job in that area most of the time. Probably held the ball for too long at times if I'm being honest...and that doesn't say small at all.

As far as arm strength I'd agree it looked a little slower than at Bama. The kid just had major hip surgery and had rehab, not training this past offseason. Looking back, not to expect some rust was definitely wrong of fans. But to think that his arm and overall body strength won't improve this offseason, yet Zach Wilson's arm will, is crazy talk. IMO all of Tua's physical attributes are going to improve this offseason. He's proven if you tell him to improve at something he will do everything in his power to do it. See Dilfer's QB camp.

I guess you don't remember Minshew Mania? That kid did nothing but grow a sweet stach, lose games and the media lined up to gobble his balls.
 
EJay said:
Gutless, bush league nonsense. If any of the players really feel this way, and it’s not Armando or other media types making $#!t up, then put your freaking name behind it!

Don’t hide behind “coach doesn’t want us to say anything crap” because if that’s the case — DON’T SAY ANYTHING! Sounds like these supposed players can’t follow simple instructions. And are gutless cowards hiding behind anonymity.

Anybody still clinging to this “Fitz is better” nonsense surely chooses to ignore a 15 season sample size of good and — mostly — bad. How convenient.

And let’s not also forget that no team Fitz has started for has EVER qualified for the postseason. Including this current Dolphins team. If MIA manages to qualify next season, I‘m fairly confident Fitz won’t be part of that team.

If we’re only judging from current season — then the pro-Fitz is better crowd also chooses to forget how awful he was against NE (a team Tua later helped defeat) or against Seattle (settling for countless FG’s) or the braindead throw against DEN to end that comeback.

In summary, no NFL team has ever been better with Fitzpatrick behind center for an entire season or most of it. This isn’t opinion. It’s backed by factual data. 17 games under .500 as a starter, no playoff appearances, and 8 teams in 16 seasons.

The guy being fiery and managing to have a hot hand for a handful of games doesn’t make him better. It’s the majority of games in a season when he doesn’t have the hot hand that kills everything.

Why some people can’t seem to recognize this despite the overwhelming evidence is baffling.

Even in 2020 — where Fitz supposedly played out of his mind — it‘s curious to note that Tua‘s record as a starter was better (despite how awful he supposedly was). And 3 of the 4 wins MIA mustered under Fitz were against JAX and NYJ. But, yeah sure, Fitz is better.

Unbelievable.
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All of this being true about Fitz doesn't make Tua any better or any more the answer.
The concerns regarding Tua are real, whether you hold those concerns or not are simply your Choice.
To get angry because others dont have the same confidence in Tua again doesn't make you any more correct.

I'm a Dolphins fan from long ago I dont care who is playing QB Tua or Donald Duck if the end results are victory and hopefully a Superbowl I'm happy.

You cant have watched Tua as a rookie and say 100% Miami knows what they have in him, thus the concern and with reason some fans have.

The team ultimately has to live with "their" evaluation and direction....it could make or break their career.

The next 4 months will give us a real indication on how they feel about Tua.
 
The Goat said:
SO:

  • Tua looked timid and unimpressive in several games
  • Tua looked good in a couple games
  • Tua looked very much like the future of the franchise in a couple games
  • Tua has not convinced "at least a handful of players" that he should be the guaranteed starter in 2021
  • Tua was a rookie coming off a major injury
  • Tua did not have very good weapons at his disposal
  • Tua didn't do as much as he could have with the weapons he had at his disposal, for whatever reason.
Here's the thing: ALL OF THE ABOVE CAN BE TRUE.

Nobody on this board knows how Tua's going to turn out. Does he have elite arm strength or running ability? No. We already knew that. But they certainly appear to be good enough to succeed.

Is there something to this story? I think so. And I can understand why WR would be disappointed in Tua as opposed to Fitz; Fitz makes them look better. He's a gunslinger who was considerably more comfortable in and familiar with Gailey's system, and he pushed the ball downfield.

However:

1) I trust Flores more than anyone who's been in the Dolphins organization for decades. He's building a team, which is more important than any individual player. Tua is currently the most important piece of that, but I trust Flores to determine if Tua's the guy to lead the team to the next level.

2) There's something to be said for the prospect of giving Tua the reins AND weapons in 2021. 9 games simply isn't enough to evaluate a QB, particularly on a team in year 2 of a rebuild. Is a year and 9 games enough? Maybe...and I think Flores/Grier will certainly know for sure, because they're smart enough to put Tua in the best position to succeed.

3) The guy we might be discounting the most is Tua himself. All the kid has done since he was young is work on his shortcomings. He finds out what he's doing wrong, and he fixes it. I'm not pushing the panic button yet, and neither should anyone here. The writing isn't on the wall. We haven't seen all we ned to see. There's just no "I told you so" stuff yet.

Fins up.
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No...we don't have ANY receivers with enough talent to say ANYTHING about anyone,ever...Including Parker...who isn't that good...he is basically the tallest midget...compared to talent of our other wideouts.
 
hoops said:
if you gave him more consistent iso win on 3rd down at flex tight end you’d make life a lot easier on the qb even with those weapons on the outside. I’m not even referring to run thru contact I’m talking I got you in an iso and my guys gonna win consistently quickly inside if need be and move the damn chains
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Not going to disagree, but if TT had those iso wins, the DC's job still isn't difficult. Not saying no harder, but no run game makes it MUCH easier. DVP and Gesicki at their best with not much else makes it easier. Miami/TT needs weapons. And, remember, I was responding to "defensive coordinators knew exactly what he was going to try to accomplish with Tua on the field." I'm not trying to defend Chan, but the O was limited due to personnel/talents
 
The Goat said:
SO:

  • Tua looked timid and unimpressive in several games
  • Tua looked good in a couple games
  • Tua looked very much like the future of the franchise in a couple games
  • Tua has not convinced "at least a handful of players" that he should be the guaranteed starter in 2021
  • Tua was a rookie coming off a major injury
  • Tua did not have very good weapons at his disposal
  • Tua didn't do as much as he could have with the weapons he had at his disposal, for whatever reason.
Here's the thing: ALL OF THE ABOVE CAN BE TRUE.

Nobody on this board knows how Tua's going to turn out. Does he have elite arm strength or running ability? No. We already knew that. But they certainly appear to be good enough to succeed.

Is there something to this story? I think so. And I can understand why WR would be disappointed in Tua as opposed to Fitz; Fitz makes them look better. He's a gunslinger who was considerably more comfortable in and familiar with Gailey's system, and he pushed the ball downfield.

However:

1) I trust Flores more than anyone who's been in the Dolphins organization for decades. He's building a team, which is more important than any individual player. Tua is currently the most important piece of that, but I trust Flores to determine if Tua's the guy to lead the team to the next level.

2) There's something to be said for the prospect of giving Tua the reins AND weapons in 2021. 9 games simply isn't enough to evaluate a QB, particularly on a team in year 2 of a rebuild. Is a year and 9 games enough? Maybe...and I think Flores/Grier will certainly know for sure, because they're smart enough to put Tua in the best position to succeed.

3) The guy we might be discounting the most is Tua himself. All the kid has done since he was young is work on his shortcomings. He finds out what he's doing wrong, and he fixes it. I'm not pushing the panic button yet, and neither should anyone here. The writing isn't on the wall. We haven't seen all we ned to see. There's just no "I told you so" stuff yet.

Fins up.
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Not according to Tua haters here.
 
“And another said that before the season finale when players were informed by Flores that Ryan Fitzpatrick would not be available against the Buffalo Bills, he was disappointed because he believes Fitzpatrick was better than Tagovailoa.”

The articles cites other players saying the same thing about benching Fitz after the raider game.

Mostly everyone thought I was wrong/crazy for suggesting the poor performance in Buffalo was attributed to a culmination of disappointment from the team in the benching of Fitz, but this information tells me I may of been right unfortunately.

Tua was not ready to play..getting him reps was not more important than thisorganization making the playoffs..
 
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BigNastyFish said:
That's contingent of the decision making process that delivered Tua and not Herbert. Lot's of folks believe Ross was the driving force and I agree. Ross loves the brand name and had attended 'bama games himself to watch Tua. That would also explain the way the Fitz situation went down and how easily Flo pulled Tua when he was stinking the place up. Ross wanted the kid on the field. Of course Grier and Flo aren't going to come out a just say "hey we wanted Herbert but Ross wanted Tua." Not gonna happen.
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I am probably naive, but I can't entirely agree that Ross influenced the pick. He wants a winning team more than anything because 1) He doesn't have long on this earth, and winning is fun. Losing sucks. 2) A winning team strengthens the Dolphin brand as a whole. If Tua is a losing QB, then his so-called brand won't mean as much.
 
Holy ****.... That idiot Armando is writing another “Breaking News” article and here we go with the “Tua Sucks” talk again. Shocker.

For all those of you who are saying “Tua Sucks”..... How sure are you that he will never be a quality starting QB in this league. I mean....All of you are 100% sure that he is going to suck horribly and hold this team back next year? What about the Cardinals game this year? How do you explain that? So to all of you....I ask....Were there were no positives from his play this year?

I’ll say it again....HE’S ONLY PLAYED 9 ****ING GAMES!!! 9!!! As far as I know....There’s 16 games in an NFL season. So that means Tua has played 56.25% of 1 season in the NFL. 56.25%!!!! Furthermore......In that 56.25% He had:

1) 1 NFL a caliber receiver who gets hurt walking to his car. Not 1 other receiver that could get separation on my grandmother....And she’s been dead since 1997
2) 1 TE that is slightly above average.
3) An OL that couldn’t pick up a stunt to save their lives.
4) An Almost NON-EXISTENT running game.

So.....That’s enough to base your expert opinion on? Is it possible, in any way, that Grier and Flores, who have already named him the starter next year mind you, are better at evaluating QB’s than you are? If you say no..... Why would you want them picking Tua’s replacement? Why aren’t any of you saying Grier and Flores should be fired for picking a small QB with no arm with the #5 pick in the draft? Explain that to me.....Please?

Please..... Just one of you “Never Tua” guys answer the questions above. I’ll wait.
 
BigNastyFish said:
...just amazing to me how folks blame EVERYTHING and EVERYONE else for Tua's obvious shortcomings (size, athleticism, arm) and underwhelming performance. He just needs everything else to be perfect then he'll be pretty good until things break down a bit an he'll be exposed. Mighty tall task to compensate for so many limitations... And the references to Brady etc. are really laughable on a number of levels -- including the basic fact the QB position is NOW more about the "athlete" than some pocket passer sitting duck.
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Burrow had two more TDs than Tua on 114 more attempts. Go find Rosen.
 
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