If Rosen Delivers Miami wins the lottery | Page 3 | FinHeaven - Miami Dolphins Forums

If Rosen Delivers Miami wins the lottery

Kamelion4291 said:
Until my boy Minshew overtakes them all.
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:lol:
 
Kamelion4291 said:
You'd think that the fan base that made excuses for Tannehill for 7 straight years wouldn't continue to do so with the next quarterback, but here we are.

Nobody learns their lesson.
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You'd think that anyone who watched a team set up a QB to fail from 2012-2018 would figure out that while QB is the most important position, you can't screw up most of the other 21 starters and the coaching staff and expect him to be successful.

But apparently not.
 
Kamelion4291 said:
You'd think that the fan base that made excuses for Tannehill for 7 straight years wouldn't continue to do so with the next quarterback, but here we are.

Nobody learns their lesson.
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I was one of the biggest Tannehill apologists on this site and can now see that set us back a decade. I honestly think coaching in his first few years was a severe impediment (philbin was atrocious -- single handedly cost us the playoffs one year) but after that the wheels started falling apart for various reasons outside of just the coaching decisions.
 
The Goat said:
You'd think that anyone who watched a team set up a QB to fail from 2012-2018 would figure out that while QB is the most important position, you can't screw up most of the other 21 starters and the coaching staff and expect him to be successful.

But apparently not.
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To win a lot of games? No. To be successful? I absolutely expect that to be the case regardless of who's on the roster.
 
fansinceGWilson said:
I gave a like to this post, although I'm uncomfortable with the bolded part. There are only 3-4 QBs who can take a team on their back and even THEY can't do it consistently. The rest, I agree.
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Yeah, when I say take on his back, i mean, make the offense look better then it should. Like I said, he does not have to win games, or put up big numbers, but he needs make something out of nothing more times then he should be.

1. In a game he is being pressured continually, yet he finds ways to get his playmakes the ball.

2. Though he is continually working from a messy pocket, he shows consistency in making good decisions.

3. Though he does not have many completions, he throws the ball in spots that it should have been caught if dropped or missed.

What he did in the 1st half was exactly what I am talking about, his stats were not Earth shattering, but I thought itbwas a very impressive half...show a bit more, with a bit more improvement and consistency then that, and I would not care if they go QB hunting next year.

I agree the taking team on his back was confusing, and not exactly what I meant, sorry about that.
 
Kamelion4291 said:
Miami's drafting a QB regardless. They are valuable commodities so even if Rosen proves he's "the guy" (which can't actually happen when you lead the team to the #1 overall pick, but I digress), then you could still trade the loser of the QB competition for a lot of draft capital so it's not like you're "wasting" the pick.
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Oh I know they're drafting a QB, but whether they draft one in the 1st or later is a big difference, and I believe up to Rosen. They may also choose to wait til 2021, if Rosen inpresses enough.
 
realdolphin said:
Hey Folks just wondering, If Rosen Continues to impress Miami could trade down and have multiple high picks to build around him in 2020. if he regresses next season Miami still has two 1st round picks and two 2nd rounders in 2021 so we could easily take the best QB again. there is no need at all to take a qb with a high pick in 2020. If Rosen develops as our Franchise QB the draft will be like winning the lottery, endless possibilities!
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A franchise QB is a rare commodity. An ELITE franchise QB is even rarer.

While it's possible to get lucky and find one outside the top 5 or top 10 or even in later rounds, history will tell you that it's easier to find one with a top pick. So when you have a top pick and a viable looking prospect is sitting there, you take him. It's that simple.

Right now the Dolphins don't know whether Josh Rosen will or won't be a franchise QB. They're not going to know by seasons end either. While there's no guarantee they'll find one in the 2020 or 2021 draft either, they still should try while they have the draft position. I mean, how often have the Dolphins had the opportunity of selecting the top QB prospect in a given draft???

IMO the appropriate thing to do is draft the top QB and if Rosen turns out to be as good as you believe, the Dolphins will be winners. Cause they'll have a franchise QB. If the prospect they draft in 2020 also proves to be equally as good, then they can always trade one of them. While you may lose value, it doesn't hurt so badly when you've found your most important piece.

I always think of an NBA analogy when someone brings up this topic. In 1984 the Portland Trailblazers held the 3rd selection in the draft. Instead of drafting Michael Jordan -- who was clearly the best player -- they drafted Sam Bowie (who was a talented Center) because they already had a star guard in Clyde Drexler.

Imagine if they had selected Jordan instead. Drexler and Jordan likely would have been Portland's version of Jordan and Pippen in Chicago. It certainly would have changed the fortune of Portland's franchise. Even if that duo didn't quite workout together, they could have received a nice haul for either player.

But passing on a top talent simply because they had another playing the same position kept that franchise from becoming what Chicago's did become.

I get that it's a bit of an apples to oranges comparison in that the NBA game is different than the NFL game, but the general idea of always taking the best or most impactful prospect still applies.
 
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EJay said:
A franchise QB is a rare commodity. An ELITE franchise QB is even rarer.

While it's possible to get lucky and find one outside the top 5 or top 10 or even in later rounds, history will tell you that it's easier to find one with a top pick. So when you have a top pick and a viable looking prospect is sitting there, you take him. It's that simple.

Right now the Dolphins don't know whether Josh Rosen will or won't be a franchise QB. They're not going to know by seasons end either. While there's no guarantee they'll find one in the 2020 or 2021 draft either, they still should try while they have the draft position. I mean, how often have the Dolphins had the opportunity of selecting the top QB prospect in a given draft???

IMO the appropriate thing to do is draft the top QB and if Rosen turns out to be as good as you believe, the Dolphins will be winners. Cause they'll have a franchise QB. If the prospect they draft in 2020 also proves to be equally as good, then they can always trade one of them. While you may lose value, it doesn't hurt so badly when you've found your most important piece.

I always think of an NBA analogy when someone brings up this topic. In 1984 the Portland Trailblazers held the 3rd selection in the draft. Instead of drafting Michael Jordan -- who was clearly the best player -- they drafted Sam Bowie (who was a talented Center) because they already had a star guard in Clyde Drexler.

Imagine if they had selected Jordan instead. Drexler and Jordan likely would have been Portland's version of Jordan and Pippen in Chicago. It certainly would have changed the fortune of Portland's franchise. Even if that duo didn't quite workout together, they could have received a nice haul for either player.

But passing on a top talent simply because they had another playing the same position kept that franchise from becoming what Chicago's did become.

I get that it's a bit of an apples to oranges comparison in that the NBA game is different than the NFL game, but the general idea of always taking the best or most impactful prospect still applies.
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Where in history has it been easier to find a franchise QB with the top pick? In the past 20 years how many of the top pick QBs won a SB compared to how many of them have been a bust.

QBs drafted in the top 5

2018 Baker Mayfield and Sam Dumba$$
2017 Mitchell Trubisky
2016 Goff and Wentz
2015 Winston and Mariota
2014 Blake Bortles LMAO
2013 ZERO!
2012 Luck and RGIII lmao
2011 Cam
2010 Sam Bradford
2009 Matt Stafford and Marky Sanchez
2008 Matt Ryan
2007 JaMarcuss Russell
2006 Vince Young
2005 Alex Smith
2004 Eli Manning SB winner and Rivers
2003 Carson Palmer
2002 David Carr and Joey Harrington
2001 Micheal Vick
2000 ZERO
1999 Tim Couch and Akili Smith
1998 Peyton Manning SB winner and Ryan Leaf
1997 ZERO
1996 ZERO
1995 Steve McNair and Kerry Collins
1994 Heath Shuler
1993 Drew Bledsoe and Rick Mirer
1992 ZERO
1991 ZERO
1990 Jeff George
1989 Troy Aikman SB winner

Here are all of the QBs drafted in the top 5 for the past 30 years. Only 3 lead their teams to win a SB.
 
06HEMI said:
First off i'm a Rosen guy. I want him to do well but #1 i think it's pretty much a lock we go QB with whatever pick we end up with regardless of how Rosen does.
#2 i keep seeing people post about how "good" he looked............... Did he?
I don't think he looked bad but let's try and remain somewhat reasonable here he didn't look good. I guess our expectations for our QB's are that low?
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I think the thought process is no quarterback is going to be great with the worst O-line in history and an overall bad receiver Corp....that drops too many balls when Rosen does make great throws.

So yes...the expectation is lowered under the circumstances.

The right scenario is to Draft the best college QB next year and let him compete with Rosen.

We are in a perfect situation to do it.

it increases the odds one of them will succeed.
 
Player development and player growth increases the human capital of your investment. It is always positive for the team. If Rosen develops, then he is a valuable commodity regardless of how the Dolphins leverage him. I cannot say if that means we hit the lottery, but it is a good thing.
 
LMAO @ the posters on this site.

Rosen Looked good in this last game against the cowboys? Really???? We didnt even scored a td remember?

These are probably the same posters who supported tannehill for 5 or 6 years LOL.
 
phinschamp45 said:
LMAO @ the posters on this site.

Rosen Looked good in this last game against the cowboys? Really???? We didnt even scored a td remember?

These are probably the same posters who supported tannehill for 5 or 6 years LOL.
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I'm going to keep posting this until it sinks in . . . to both sides.
The ONLY thing that matters is Flo's evaluation and he didn't make it Monday AM. He'll give Rosen until game 12 or later and make the evaluation then. If his play stay at the same level of the Boys game, Flo will go QB hunting. If Rosen improves to what Flo sees as a solid starter, no R1 QB next year. I doubt Flo cares about the number of wins or TDs. Doesn't care about dropped passes. He wants a QB who play at a top level (not necessarily elite), is consistent, and smart.
A little OT, but my view on Tannehill was a gifted athlete with all the physical tools, but didn't seem mentally quick enough to be anything other than a serviceable QB. Most QBs fail in the NFL for lack of mental quickness - not because they are poor athletes. If Rosen shows the mental quickness Flo want, Rosen IMO, will be Miami's franchise QB. No one will know til end of season
 
Kamelion4291 said:
Until my boy Minshew overtakes them all.
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I loved Minshew last year, I really wanted us to take a flier on him in a late round. More for his locker room presence than anything else, I'm really happy to see him having some success with the Jags, he can make a lot of money in this league as a back up, he may even become a regular starter. Remember first drawn to him when WASU played Oregon last year, he totally outplayed Herbert that day, one of the reasons why I've fallen of the Herbert train, would hate that pick if we made it next year.
 
Geordie said:
I loved Minshew last year, I really wanted us to take a flier on him in a late round. More for his locker room presence than anything else, I'm really happy to see him having some success with the Jags, he can make a lot of money in this league as a back up, he may even become a regular starter. Remember first drawn to him when WASU played Oregon last year, he totally outplayed Herbert that day, one of the reasons why I've fallen of the Herbert train, would hate that pick if we made it next year.
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I'm really just joking with the Minshew thing, but he's just a recent example of a QB thrown into the mix on a bad team (along with Daniel Jones) and plays well, something that gets lost with the myriad of excuses getting thrown around for Rosen. If you're good, you're good. Doesn't matter what's around you. You'll make good throws. You'll make good decisions. You'll hit guys in stride. You won't put them in the hospital. Adding talent only enhances their ability to function and put up even better numbers. It isn't a f*cking prerequisite to playing well.

Edit: Side note, if Minshew plays well this season, Mike Leach is probably going to get a real look in the NFL finally.
 
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