Post Preseason Game #3: Stock Report | Page 3 | FinHeaven - Miami Dolphins Forums

Post Preseason Game #3: Stock Report

Locke said:
How do you assume we don't? You're caught up on semantics when the point is we were in the driver's seat...
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you know daboll stayed vanilla at GL just like last week. you think the guy is going to show his stuff to New England? no way no how.
 
finfan54 said:
you know daboll stayed vanilla at GL just like last week. you think the guy is going to show his stuff to New England? no way no how.
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Funny that you say that because that was my thinking the moment they did nothing again near the endzone. I doubt very much, for a pre-season TD, they will show what their O will do. I wasn't worried, mad or anything when we came up short. It's either an open receiver, an open lane for us to score near the goalline. I don't want to give New England anything to plan for in our game.
 
Great post! I would add Nolan Carroll to the Negative Honorable mention for the last 2 weeks. He seems to be regressing IMO.
 
Unless you show to have J. Cribbs or D. Hester ability you can't hold a roster spot for a guy just to return, especially with the new kickoff rules. Livas is too weak and probably wont make it through the season. To be a great returner, you have to have the ability to break the first tackle, especially punt returns. Excluding his return, he hasn't shown consistent ability to break the first tackle (usually arm tackles) on punt returns. I think they are giving him every opportunity to show them something. I think you can put C Gates as returner and get the same production and because of his speed he may occasionally break one but also serves as deep threat as a receiver. Have we seen Livas line up at receiver and catch a pass? That's not worth a gameday roster spot.

What do you all think about CB? I haven't seen much on W. Allen.

IMO, I think you cut W. Allen; yes he is a veteran, but you have to look past this year and he is definitely not part of the future. However, he did move pretty well. I'm really excited to see the development of J. Wilson; kid really looks like a playmaker.

Wouldn't surprise me if L. Polite is cut as he doesn't offer much value to hold a spot; it's not like he is the top run blocking FB.

It will be interesting who they cut at WR and CB. I don't know if they give up on Wallace but man does he look the part though. And you can never have enough speed at WR, which is what is keeping M. Moore alive.
 
my only hope with the O line is that last night the coaching staff just wanted them to do "brush" blocks to see how Henne did "under duress"!!!
 
Great read as usual homie.

I agree on all accounts, but a couple of things just bug me.

Like Sean Smith, I saw the improvement last year, he looked really good. But that play took me back to his rookie season, it was really upsetting. I thought he was past that. All I can say is, I hope he is waiting for the regular season to start playing 100% again, I know he has it in him to be a great one.

And Livas, I cannot understand where this kid went. You dont just fall off like that, and I dont think you get a 'lucky' return in the NFL. Now maybe its because it was wk 1 of preseason or something. But I cant help but think that this kid has the talent, we just need to uncover it. He certainly has the right mindset, from his interviews and such, but man he has been absent to say the least since ATL. Really frustrating.
 
Kdawg954 said:
After a Great Week of upward trends against the Panthers, the stocks came crashing down against the Bucs.

Stock Up

Chad Henne - He was accurate, he showed touch, he looks like he is showing much better command when at the line of scrimmage and he is chillin on the sidelines with Fasano and Marshall. What Chad Henne is this? The pass to Marshall was a thing of beauty. Started off slow on that first play, but he dusted himself off and led the troops. The OLine was terrible, and Henne still performed well . . . good to see. To quote someone in the chat last night "If the OLine is this bad, Chad Henne may have to carry us this year". The Henne haters are still making noises, although they are smaller noises, but the attention maybe focused on the OLine going forward. As for Henne, gotta get that ball in the endzone a little more . . . but the improvements are visible, very visible.

Kevin Burnett - I was a Crowder guy, but man Burnett is a major upgrade. He tackles well, he pressures the QB, he sticks to his man in coverage, he can play all 3 downs. The guy was all over the field last night. Miami really hit a homerun with this pickup.

Brandon Marshall - Yea he fumbled . . . but we saw the BEAST last night. Dude was breaking tackles, stiff arming, YAC, etc. They may have been forcing the passes to Brandon early on, but that communication seems clear. In Henning's offense, Henne's guy was Davone Bess . . . in Daboll's offense, his guy is Brandon Marshall. That is a great thing.

Vontae Davis - Vontae took alot of heat for his comments, but he came to play last night. Solid in coverage, picked off a Freeman pass early while blanketing Mike Williams though it was called back. He had another chance at a pickoff on a deflection but dropped it. Solid tackler, glad he showed up last night . . . he definitely had some spring in his step.

Jason Trusnick - After landing in my "Stock Down" category last week . . . Mr. Trusnick showed up big time. He was a clear force on special teams. I believe he had atleast 3 tackles on special teams. He came in on defense and was applying pressure and making sure tackles as well. I honestly think he probably made the team last night. Offers that position versatility and is clearly a solid special teamer.

Stock Down

The Offensive Line - Absolutely DREADFUL. They lost every battle on every snap. Murtha/Colombo were TERRIBLE on the ends. Vernon Carey was getting beat and at times looked a little lost. 17 carries and 22 yards says it all. Take away Pouncey, we are just too unathletic on this line w/o big Jake . . . who for the LOVE OF GOD make it back in time for New England. Once again we provided no push on goalline situations, Polite was stuffed on a 3rd and 1, Henne was feeling pressure the entire game. It was bad and I didn't even talk about the penalties, smh.

Sean Smith - You starting this **** again bro? Dropping picks, half azz tackles and what was up with the "pop up" attempt when you got beat? Dude got like an extra 20 yards because of it. Vontae backed his talk up, but you played awful last night. Get it together man, because Jimmy Wilson ain't playin.

Phillip Livas - 2nd week in a row he makes it on the stock down list, and Miami is probably going to start looking for replacements. He doesn't break tackles, he isn't a burner, he doesn't play WR and when teams get a hold of him, they throw him back. PS guy if he clears waivers . . . don't see him making it unless he has an unbelieveable 4th game.

Roberto Wallace - I like Wallace, but he has been AWOL the last two weeks and there was even some miscommunication between him and the QB tonight. Looks like Sparano was giving him an earful as well after one play. Plus he hasn't been as noticeable on special teams either. Not good. I still think he makes it, but he isn't nearly as much of alock as he was after the first game. Still has tremendous upside.

Lou Polite - His time may be up in Miami. The line was bad, but he was well short on a 3rd and 1 opportunity and he is usually money there. Haven't really seen much of him this preseason, but he isn't a standout blocker and he is very mehhh as an offensive weapon. I dunno, I think he could end up being one of those "surprise cuts" when its all said and done . . . though I know it won't be a surprise to a few people.

Honorable Mentions

Jimmy Wilson - Jimmy is a BALLER and a 7th round steal. He can hit, he can break up passes and he has been consistent. He is an offical LOCK, no doubt in my mind. He is gonna light some people up on special teams this year.

Marloon Moore - I saw you . . . what a catch man. I like to see that, and another catch and run similar to that Raiders play last season. Way to stick in there and improve off the drop seen around the world last week. With Livas dropping off and Wallace AWOL the last 2 weeks, you may have a shot afterall. Keep it up.

Brandon Fields - We know you're a beast, you killed again sir.

Negative Honorable Mention

The refs - Made the game unbearable to watch. I couldn't even focus on alot of the 2nd half and I refuse to rewatch it . . . it was bad living through once, I won't do it again. They called everything. I think they were around 26 or 27 penalties. At times I got mad at them throwing flags on Tampa. Brutal.

Overall

Being optimistic, you take away the OLine play, the Fins didn't play bad. Henne for the most part was sharp, Marshall played big, the defense let some middle of the field stuff go but they didn't break. The OLine is a HUGE question mark going into the final week and into the first game. Jake Long can't get better soon enough, but we are gonna need more than his health to have a solid unit. I'm expecting some moves to be made this week. Enough is enough.
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you forgot one player ? koa misi he was getting pretty good push BUT he wasnt going after the QB he would push back to the QB but he didnt turn loose of his player or the player he was locked on had hands of steel and misi couldnt break free it was like he pushed the player he was locked onto bk to the QB and that was it (Watch the game and you guys will see what im talking about )it was like he didnt have that extra spunk to drive bk to the QB and then break loose and sack . there were other players that i didnt get to see close but ill be watching the game on nfln tonite to see more (was watching on streaming it wasnt real clear) but look to me like some of our guys didnt eat there wheaties
 
ms2126 said:
Unless you show to have J. Cribbs or D. Hester ability you can't hold a roster spot for a guy just to return, especially with the new kickoff rules. Livas is too weak and probably wont make it through the season. To be a great returner, you have to have the ability to break the first tackle, especially punt returns. Excluding his return, he hasn't shown consistent ability to break the first tackle (usually arm tackles) on punt returns. I think they are giving him every opportunity to show them something. I think you can put C Gates as returner and get the same production and because of his speed he may occasionally break one but also serves as deep threat as a receiver. Have we seen Livas line up at receiver and catch a pass? That's not worth a gameday roster spot.

What do you all think about CB? I haven't seen much on W. Allen.

IMO, I think you cut W. Allen; yes he is a veteran, but you have to look past this year and he is definitely not part of the future. However, he did move pretty well. I'm really excited to see the development of J. Wilson; kid really looks like a playmaker.

Wouldn't surprise me if L. Polite is cut as he doesn't offer much value to hold a spot; it's not like he is the top run blocking FB.

It will be interesting who they cut at WR and CB. I don't know if they give up on Wallace but man does he look the part though. And you can never have enough speed at WR, which is what is keeping M. Moore alive.
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imo will allen did pretty good last nite since he hasnt been in there at all this year and has been out for 2 years he made some pretty good tackles and as for polite i dont see us cutting him because sprano said you dont find a real FB in the league that its a dying breed and if you find one better hang onto them.
 
Good post, Kdawg. I agree with most of it, though I would disagree that Sean Smith had a bad night. He made one poor play but he was good in coverage. Mike Williams is one of the top young WRs in the game and he pretty much had him blanketed when Williams was on his side. Jimmy Wilson is no threat to his starting job at all.

One negative I would add is Cameron Wake in coverage. I wouldn't say that puts his stock down but they had Wake in man or zone coverage like a half dozen times last night which is like the equivalent to half a season's worth of reps for him. And, predictably, he didn't do that well. My suspicion is that they wanted to put it on tape not just to give Wake something to work on but to make the Patriots have to practice and prepare for it. If you can convince the Pats that you might drop Wake in coverage and overload blitz to the other side, you make them think twice about sliding the protection.

That's just a guess, of course, but I couldn't shake that feeling watching the game last night.
 
Mr. Magoo said:
Good post, Kdawg. I agree with most of it, though I would disagree that Sean Smith had a bad night. He made one poor play but he was good in coverage. Mike Williams is one of the top young WRs in the game and he pretty much had him blanketed when Williams was on his side. Jimmy Wilson is no threat to his starting job at all.

One negative I would add is Cameron Wake in coverage. I wouldn't say that puts his stock down but they had Wake in man or zone coverage like a half dozen times last night which is like the equivalent to half a season's worth of reps for him. And, predictably, he didn't do that well. My suspicion is that they wanted to put it on tape not just to give Wake something to work on but to make the Patriots have to practice and prepare for it. If you can convince the Pats that you might drop Wake in coverage and overload blitz to the other side, you make them think twice about sliding the protection.

That's just a guess, of course, but I couldn't shake that feeling watching the game last night.
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you have to overload blitz or stunt on the other side with jason taylor cause he can't beat guys one on one on the edge anymore...i agree that wake in coverage is not good...i saw guys he was trailing open a lot but damn this is the only guy we got who can get to the freakin qb on the outside without it having to be scheme driven...let the guy freakin hunt as much as possible...an awful lot of dropping from wake in this game i hope i don't see come the regular season...ehhh...i just don't see anyone who can do anything without us scheming a way to get them clean looks at olb...cam wakes gonna see so much rolled protections its not funny...he should at least
 
I was so excited when they drafted Wilson, just knowing what was expected of him before his tragic story and all that. Glad to see he is taking advantage of the 2nd opportunity to play some ball.
If Sean doesn't step up, and stop believing his own hype, I think the best tandem in the game in the not too distant future will be Davis/Wilson
 
nothing like seeing koa misi already replaced by jason taylor on passing downs...ladies and gentleman your 2 down olb mr koa misi...if jt at this satge can beat you out on the outside you obviously haven't developed as a pass rusher...then again jt's probably living off his reputation with this coaching staff

b/t trusnick was a lock to make this roster for his special teams play alone...we just all better hope he's never getting run in the base...cause he'll go nowhere

and i noticed marvin mitchell who looks like at least til we see whats out there on finals cuts he may have worked his way into the 4th ilb on the 53 is running with the ones on kick teams and i saw daniel thomas also out there on the first team kick coverage unit...that may not bode well for him as far as how they feel about him in the base o
 
One bad play doesn't make Smiths stock drop. It wasn't like he was arm whiffing all night..I don't even think Smith dropped a pick. Bell dropped 1 in the first quarter and I believe Vontae in the 2nd quarter...I stopped watching after Marshall fumbled.. Everybody knows Sean Smith isn't an aggressive great tackling corner. Hes good in coverage, and a decent tackler. Hes not Vontae Davis who is a beast great corner, and you rarely have two great corners on the same team. Having one great, and one really good one isn't that bad..
 
I think Will Allen should be in the stock up pile as well.. Came in and played well for his first time being back in a few years. Wasn't really a standout performance, but great seeing the guy back on the field.
 
hooshoops said:
you have to overload blitz or stunt on the other side with jason taylor cause he can't beat guys one on one on the edge anymore...i agree that wake in coverage is not good...i saw guys he was trailing open a lot but damn this is the only guy we got who can get to the freakin qb on the outside without it having to be scheme driven...let the guy freakin hunt as much as possible...an awful lot of dropping from wake in this game i hope i don't see come the regular season...ehhh...i just don't see anyone who can do anything without us scheming a way to get them clean looks at olb...cam wakes gonna see so much rolled protections its not funny...he should at least
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Oh, I don't disagree. You want Wake after Brady as often as possible. But if you can make Brady think that Wake might drop into coverage because an overload blitz is coming from the other side, then you might stop him from sliding his protection toward #91. Then... if Wake rushes anyway, he's going to be in better position to get after that ******* because he won't be facing a double team.

Every time you can stop Brady sliding the protection toward Wake, that's a victory for your defense. And then, if he's not taking the bait and is still sliding the protection toward Wake, you really do drop Wake into coverage once and overload from the other side. Then that can be a victory (unless Wake really blows his coverage, which he might do).

When I saw Wake dropping that many times, I saw Nolan trying to play some mind games with Tom Brady. The key is if he really graded poorly (I need to watch again to see what I thought, but he was clearly no better than average -- which is honestly not bad for a dedicated pass rusher. Most of them are poor in coverage), then you run the risk of getting gutted, as we were on Blount's long completion (that was Wake's man, I believe). All they need to do is not royally **** up, because dropping defensive linemen are tough for any quarterback to spot and deal with. I was just watching the Broncos/Seahawks game a few hours ago and DE Chris Clemons picked off Kyle Orton just that way.
 
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