The OFFICIAL draft Cam Newton Thread!!!

[hoops]

If I'm taking a shot on a quarterback in the 1st round, he has to answer two main questions:

1. Do I feel like he can come in and start as a rookie?

2. Will he be the hardest worker on the team, and does he make good decisions on and off the field?




Everything else only determines how high...

i'll take it #2 is where you have a no answer...i do feel like cam can start next year if we run an offense that plays to his strengths...if not week 8 maybe by half way thru the season...but i don't trust daboll and sparano to do anything but what they know...rinse...repeat

 

[RobertHorry]

Not ANY-wise.

Literally almost every single means of measuring QB performance disagrees with your statement.

Cam Newton and Chris Todd both played against Mississippi State, Arkansas, Kentucky, LSU, Ole Miss, Georgia and Alabama. Todd was 90 of 164 for 1077 yards, 5 TDs and 5 INTs. Newton was 87 of 129 for 1145 yards, 10 TDs and 3 INTs.

Tell me, since obviously you scoured every single pass Chris Todd had at Auburn along with every single pass Newton had, to the extent that you're confident tossing ALL generally accepted measures of a QB's passing performance in order to claim circumstances and personal performance were actually the same, why do you believe so? How do you account for the OBVIOUS differences in their passing performances? Cite some examples.

Listen, you have your opinion on Newton and that's cool. I don't mind people disagreeing and having their own opinion. I prefer it that way. But having your opinion and having the right to it does not mean it's OK to shovel absolute hogwash down peoples throats in order to support your opinion, trying to make people believe that via some magical, mysterious, totally ambiguous and transfigurable means of measurement, Cam Newton did not outperform Chris Todd as a PASSER this season.

I never said I scouted every pass of Todd or Newton...

I never shoved down my belief down anyones throat either. What I said is that he replicated Todd as a passer. Newton has legs though too. Malzahn incorporated that into the offense and it made the offense even more deadlier than it was. Are you seriously going to tell me Newton was able to beat teams with just him arm? No, he wasn't thus Malzahn molded an offense that had both legs and arms playing a major role. Todd was ok with mobility. He could get in and out of the pocket if needed but not to a great degree. What Todd had was the passing ability needed on timing routes. Anyways, I still say that Todd and Newton had the same year passing wise. Even if stats don't tell the story. Newton had another weapon in his legs which Todd didn't.

 

[Pachyderm_Wave]

I've never thought Cam Newton is ready to start in the NFL as a rookie, so I get a no answer to both.

Starting as a rookie and being ready to start are two different things...

If you're going to run an offense that plays to his current strengths, then you'll be running a lot of option football.

 

[RobertHorry]

i'll take it #2 is where you have a no answer...i do feel like cam can start next year if we run an offense that plays to his strengths...if not week 8 maybe by half way thru the season...but i don't trust daboll and sparano to do anything but what they know...rinse...repeat

The decisions part is troubling to me. I don't know how Newton will react when teams come out with multiple alignments and coverages. When teams take away his first two reads and he goes back and throw a pass with bad ball location to his 3rd read out of panic and needing to get the ball out

Starting isnt as troubling, but I'm not sure he could start

 

[hoops]

I've never thought Cam Newton is ready to start in the NFL as a rookie, so I get a no answer to both.

Starting as a rookie and being ready to start are two different things...

If you're going to run an offense that plays to his current strengths, then you'll be running a lot of option football.

i see what you're saying but to me i see newton as being more ready to play than vince young was when he came out...i just think newtons got the it factor so many guys don't

hard to explain...maybe its just my gut

 

[RobertHorry]

The it factor was pretty much lacking on the last drive of the national game in regulation.

So much that Malzahn decided to run a series of screens and runs to get the ball out of Newton's hands.

 

[dolfan22]

If I'm taking a shot on a quarterback in the 1st round, he has to answer two main questions:

1. Do I feel like he can come in and start as a rookie?

2. Will he be the hardest worker on the team, and does he make good decisions on and off the field?




Everything else only determines how high...

With respect , isn't #1 being some what short sighted?

What do you do if you need a franchise QB and you don't have one who can start immediately fall into your lap? Rodgers wasn't ready to startyear one.

#2 is a given , or should be.

Short term pain for longer term gain ,if you need to develop your QB , but he IS the right guy , I see no issue in taking him in round one and letting him start when he is indeed ready ala Palmer , Rodgers etc.

 

[hoops]

The it factor was pretty much lacking on the last drive of the national game in regulation.

So much that Malzahn decided to run a series of screens and runs to get the ball out of Newton's hands.

newton was hurt...on that 26 yard scramble run late in the game newton when he went to ground got speared in the helmet or ribs or a little of both by #20...he was never the same after...i know this cause i have rewatched that game like 3 times and it was very obvious when and how newton got injured...after the game he even left the presser early to go get some x rays done...(ribs was my assumption)

 

[datruth55]

With respect , isn't #1 being some what short sighted?

What do you do if you need a franchise QB and you don't have one who can start immediately fall into your lap? Rodgers wasn't ready to startyear one.

#2 is a given , or should be.

Short term pain for longer term gain ,if you need to develop your QB , but he IS the right guy , I see no issue in taking him in round one and letting him start when he is indeed ready ala Palmer , Rodgers etc.

I think Rodgers could have started his rookie year...but he didn't have to because Favre was there and that's why Green Bay is making the playoffs more often than the Dolphins and getting to championships (NFC or Super Bowl) and we haven't sniffed the AFC Championship game since 1992.

 

[Pachyderm_Wave]

Not ANY-wise.

Literally almost every single means of measuring QB performance disagrees with your statement.

Cam Newton and Chris Todd both played against Mississippi State, Arkansas, Kentucky, LSU, Ole Miss, Georgia and Alabama. Todd was 90 of 164 for 1077 yards, 5 TDs and 5 INTs. Newton was 87 of 129 for 1145 yards, 10 TDs and 3 INTs.

Tell me, since obviously you scoured every single pass Chris Todd had at Auburn along with every single pass Newton had, to the extent that you're confident tossing ALL generally accepted measures of a QB's passing performance in order to claim circumstances and personal performance were actually the same, why do you believe so? How do you account for the OBVIOUS differences in their passing performances? Cite some examples.

Listen, you have your opinion on Newton and that's cool. I don't mind people disagreeing and having their own opinion. I prefer it that way. But having your opinion and having the right to it does not mean it's OK to shovel absolute hogwash down peoples throats in order to support your opinion, trying to make people believe that via some magical, mysterious, totally ambiguous and transfigurable means of measurement, Cam Newton did not outperform Chris Todd as a PASSER this season.

That's not it at all, here's how they both fared:


Chris Todd vs. Miss. St. -- 1 TD, 0 INT's / 129.23

Cam Newton vs. Miss. St. -- 2 TD's, 1 INT / 142.25


Chris Todd vs. #25 West Virginia -- 4 TD's, 1 INT / 161.82

Cam Newton vs. Clemson -- 2 TD's, 2 INT's / 190.37


Chris Todd vs. Arkansas -- 0 TD's, 0 INT's / 90.24

Cam Newton vs. Arkansas -- 1 TD, 0 INT's / 167.07


Chris Todd vs. Kentucky -- 0 TD's, 1 INT / 67.92

Cam Newton vs. Kentucky -- 0 TD's, 1 INT / 136.39


Chris Todd vs. LSU -- 1 TD, 1 INT / 95.52

Cam Newton vs. LSU -- 0 TD's, 0 INT's / 107.65


Chris Todd vs. Ole Miss -- 2 TD's, 0 INT's / 160.77

Cam Newton vs. Ole Miss -- 3 TD's, 0 INT's / 192. 54


Chris Todd vs. UGA -- 2 TD's, 2 INT's / 152.11

Cam Newton vs. UGA -- 2 TD's, 1 INT / 181.45


Chris Todd vs. Bama -- 2 TD's, 1 INT / 128.90

Cam Newton vs. Bama -- 3 TD's, 0 INT's / 205.22


Chris Todd vs. Tennessee -- 1 TD, 0 INT's / 122.97

Cam Newton didn't play Tennessee, they played South Carolina instead.... 4 TD's, and 0 INT's...






That's 13 TD's and 6 INT's for Chris Todd.... and 13 TD's and 5 INT's for Cam Newton.

17-5 if you throw in the South Carolina game where he ran for almost 200 yards on the ground.

Cam Newton replicated Chris Todd's passing success, Cam Newton did 80% of his damage against SEC competition on the ground... that's how Gus Malzahn designed it.

 

[RobertHorry]

That's not it at all, here's how they both faired:


Chris Todd vs. Miss. St. -- 1 TD, 0 INT's / 129.23

Cam Newton vs. Miss. St. -- 2 TD's, 1 INT / 142.25


Chris Todd vs. #25 West Virginia -- 4 TD's, 1 INT / 161.82

Cam Newton vs. Clemson -- 2 TD's, 2 INT's / 190.37


Chris Todd vs. Arkansas -- 0 TD's, 0 INT's / 90.24

Cam Newton vs. Arkansas -- 1 TD, 0 INT's / 167.07


Chris Todd vs. Kentucky -- 0 TD's, 1 INT / 67.92

Cam Newton vs. Kentucky -- 0 TD's, 1 INT / 136.39


Chris Todd vs. LSU -- 1 TD, 1 INT / 95.52

Cam Newton vs. LSU -- 0 TD's, 0 INT's / 107.65


Chris Todd vs. Ole Miss -- 2 TD's, 0 INT's / 160.77

Cam Newton vs. Ole Miss -- 3 TD's, 0 INT's / 192. 54


Chris Todd vs. UGA -- 2 TD's, 2 INT's / 152.11

Cam Newton vs. UGA -- 2 TD's, 1 INT / 181.45


Chris Todd vs. Bama -- 2 TD's, 1 INT / 128.90

Cam Newton vs. Bama -- 3 TD's, 0 INT's / 205.22


Chris Todd vs. Tennessee -- 1 TD, 0 INT's / 122.97






That's 13 TD's and 6 INT's for Chris Todd.... and 13 TD's and 5 INT's for Cam Newton.


Cam Newton replicated Chris Todd's passing success, Cam Newton 80% of his damage against SEC competition on the ground.

This is exactly what I have been saying. Newton had a better overall performance due to his ability to run. However, he replicated the PASSING performance of Todd. The difference is, Newton is a dual-threat QB who can run and throw. But I don't think he could beat many teams if he was forced to use mostly/only his arm.

 

[hoops]

aaron rodgers is better already than brett favre was ...yep...i said it

 

[dolfan22]

I think Rodgers could have started his rookie year...but he didn't have to because Favre was there and that's why Green Bay is making the playoffs more often than the Dolphins and getting to championships (NFC or Super Bowl) and we haven't sniffed the AFC Championship game since 1992.

Yes , obviously Favre was there and could Rodgers have started? Sure , anyone "could" it doesn't mean it would be the best decision though. I think he wasn't ready to start , certainly not optimally. It isn't carved in stone , some QB's are better to get in there right away , some benefit from some seasoning.

---------- Post added at 01:52 PM ---------- Previous post was at 01:51 PM ----------

aaron rodgers is better already than brett favre was ...yep...i said it

No disagreement at all !

 

[hoops]

rodgers wasn't ready to start til he lost that mullet he sported for a while there when he was favre's backup...lol

honestly...i think aaron rodgers is the best young qb in the game...by far

 

[Pachyderm_Wave]

With respect , isn't #1 being some what short sighted?

What do you do if you need a franchise QB and you don't have one who can start immediately fall into your lap? Rodgers wasn't ready to startyear one.

#2 is a given , or should be.

Short term pain for longer term gain ,if you need to develop your QB , but he IS the right guy , I see no issue in taking him in round one and letting him start when he is indeed ready ala Palmer , Rodgers etc.

Rodgers could have started as a rookie, and they took him with that in mind while Favre was busy waffling over whether to come back or not...

I don't see a problem with drafting a QB in the 1st round and sitting him behind a veteran for a season if you have that luxury, but if you're going to take a quarterback in the 1st round, you should feel like he's CAPABLE of starting as a rookie..

Otherwise, he's at least a 2nd round pick.

That's how I look at it, doesn't mean you or anybody else has to... You can flip head over heels for every spread option quarterback that comes out of college with "all the tools" and pound your fist over how they're all franchise quarterbacks for all I care...

I'll stick to mine...