Waddle on the cusp of 1,000 yard rookie season | Page 2 | FinHeaven - Miami Dolphins Forums

Waddle on the cusp of 1,000 yard rookie season

It's obvious he can catch the ball and get open. Anyway you slice it if you get 1,000 yards as a rookie receiver that's pretty impressive. That said, what the Dolphins did to draft him, and how they've used him, really suggests they thought he'd be electric with the ball in his hands. I think they really envisioned a guy who could turn short passes into long gains regularly. And unfortunately he doesn't show any ability to make defenders miss or get past them after the catch.

The production is something to be excited about. Happy to have him on the team. But, through no fault of his own, I think the front office and coaching staff evaluated Waddle to be able to things he hasn't been able to do on the NFL field.

I think he will be that YAC guy when the offense opens up. Right now everything is condensed into a small box so to speak.

I don't care how good after tge catch you were in college, you aren't making 3 defenders miss within 5 yards at this level.

When we get some better spacing I really expect his YAC to improve.
 
We could make a pretty long list of amazing NFL WR’s that didn’t sniff 1,000 yards in their rookie season. In fact, WR is often considered to be the position that kinda needs that first year as a dress rehearsal to adjust to the NFL.

When you factor in everything: Tua injuries, awful back-up QB play, horrid O-line play, no semblance of a running game, the dual OC fiasco, the Deshaun Watson sideshow, and the fact that right now he’s being used more as a dink n dunk receiver out of necessity, it’s a minor miracle that the kid is on pace for around 940 yards.

It sucks that Philly has our 1st round pick next year, but I’m thrilled to have this kid. If a new GM comes in next year and stabilizes the ship, he’s going to be an absolute star. We also need to do whatever it takes to resign Gesecki and keep Hollins on the field as these three guys have an attitude, passion, and toughness that seems to be lacking from all the other pass catchers on our roster. Put an O-line on the field that can give a QB more than 1.5 seconds to throw the ball and watch Waddle turn into an absolute nightmare for opponents.

Grier has botched so many of our picks, but hopefully by next year we see Waddle as his parting gift to the Miami Dolphins.
And to think what he'd have if they actually weren't wasting his talent. I'm thinking the numbers he'd have if he was on the Bengals
 
Has nothing to do with the player. He’ll be here long after this regime is gone.

This. I have no worries about Phillips. Kid is a beast waiting to be used effectively and is still getting really close to making some plays each week, even with the crap defensive schemes.
 
Do not forget on pace for a 100 receptions and maybe a 1,000 yds. That is special as a rookie. I wanted Waddle over everybody during the draft, and I am please with trading that went on during the draft. It will end up being a win for the Phins.
 
I think he will be that YAC guy when the offense opens up. Right now everything is condensed into a small box so to speak.

I don't care how good after tge catch you were in college, you aren't making 3 defenders miss within 5 yards at this level.

When we get some better spacing I really expect his YAC to improve.
I agree with you there. Of course his YAC will improve with better spacing. So, of course, would Durham Smythe's, and everyone else on the team. Gaskin can't make defenders miss, but he had that sensational catch and run against the Raiders in week 16 that would have been a well remembered play in Dolphins lore if the last few minutes of the game hadn't involved two more lead changes including Fitz's throw when his face was sideways.

But what Waddle is simply not good at is making guys miss. And while that's something that I have observed, it's also something that is statistically tracked- I apologize, I don't know where I saw it, I came across that two weeks ago, and remembered it because it confirmed what I thought I was seeing. And noting on the field the last two weeks made me believe that's changed. The stats show that Waddle was like the third worst player or at least third worst receiver in the league at making the first guy miss. While the overall production is influenced by spacing, not making a guy miss- that's just a one on one matchup that he simply is never winning. He catches the ball and then gets brought down by the closest defender almost all the time, whenever that is. I mean, I've seen Devante Parker, who really isn't a YAC guy unless he catches a slant in stride, catch some passes and just sidestep a guy to get 4-5 yards before the next defender gets there. And Waddle just doesn't do that.

The reason why I say the Dolphins missed their eval on him - I mean we've schemed up more routes and plays for him than all our other players combined, partially due to availability, and the stuff we've been running with him really only makes sense when a guy can catch a pass and elude the nearest defender (like bubble screens). The team traded out of the opportunity to draft a guy with a more downfield body type and play style like chase, and clearly they wanted to pair a QB who excels at ball placement on short routes with a guy who they thought could catch the ball and make defenders miss.

It seems like the ability to either elude or evade tacklers is something more predicated on physical skill and ability than something developed over time, like route running and technique, so I don't know if Waddle will ever get drastically better. It's really not uncommon for guys to make a lot of players miss at the college level because they are just faster than everyone else to struggle to get around guys at the next level when suddenly that aren't head and shoulders faster than the competition.
 
There are only 2 players in the top 75 receivers who average less ypr than Waddle, Cole Beasley and Noah Fant, a TE. And it's not from lack of effort. He's been targeted like 75 times. It's hard to discern if it's just play design, QB play or Waddle lacking the lateral quickness and YAC ability everyone thought he had. He's not shown that Tyreek Hill/Marquise Brown skill set yet.
 
Good slot receiver, if we had a number and a solid on-line it would have been a good pick. Unfortunately, if Waddle was on pace to get 4k yards it is not going to win a Superbowl.
 
With our bullshit high school offense anybody that looks good could be a perennial or pro on a good team. We see who those guys can be, Mike G and waddle or locks I don’t think anyone else
 
It's obvious he can catch the ball and get open. Anyway you slice it if you get 1,000 yards as a rookie receiver that's pretty impressive. That said, what the Dolphins did to draft him, and how they've used him, really suggests they thought he'd be electric with the ball in his hands. I think they really envisioned a guy who could turn short passes into long gains regularly. And unfortunately he doesn't show any ability to make defenders miss or get past them after the catch.

The production is something to be excited about. Happy to have him on the team. But, through no fault of his own, I think the front office and coaching staff evaluated Waddle to be able to things he hasn't been able to do on the NFL field.

The lack of a running game I believe is having a significant effect on how they are playing him.

Him and Gesicki are getting the lion’s share of attention by defenses.

When we need a play extra attention gets put on those to which leaves us the leftovers to try and gain an advantage.
 
I agree with you there. Of course his YAC will improve with better spacing. So, of course, would Durham Smythe's, and everyone else on the team. Gaskin can't make defenders miss, but he had that sensational catch and run against the Raiders in week 16 that would have been a well remembered play in Dolphins lore if the last few minutes of the game hadn't involved two more lead changes including Fitz's throw when his face was sideways.

But what Waddle is simply not good at is making guys miss. And while that's something that I have observed, it's also something that is statistically tracked- I apologize, I don't know where I saw it, I came across that two weeks ago, and remembered it because it confirmed what I thought I was seeing. And noting on the field the last two weeks made me believe that's changed. The stats show that Waddle was like the third worst player or at least third worst receiver in the league at making the first guy miss. While the overall production is influenced by spacing, not making a guy miss- that's just a one on one matchup that he simply is never winning. He catches the ball and then gets brought down by the closest defender almost all the time, whenever that is. I mean, I've seen Devante Parker, who really isn't a YAC guy unless he catches a slant in stride, catch some passes and just sidestep a guy to get 4-5 yards before the next defender gets there. And Waddle just doesn't do that.

The reason why I say the Dolphins missed their eval on him - I mean we've schemed up more routes and plays for him than all our other players combined, partially due to availability, and the stuff we've been running with him really only makes sense when a guy can catch a pass and elude the nearest defender (like bubble screens). The team traded out of the opportunity to draft a guy with a more downfield body type and play style like chase, and clearly they wanted to pair a QB who excels at ball placement on short routes with a guy who they thought could catch the ball and make defenders miss.

It seems like the ability to either elude or evade tacklers is something more predicated on physical skill and ability than something developed over time, like route running and technique, so I don't know if Waddle will ever get drastically better. It's really not uncommon for guys to make a lot of players miss at the college level because they are just faster than everyone else to struggle to get around guys at the next level when suddenly that aren't head and shoulders faster than the competition.

Not saying I don’t believe you. But would you post what you were looking at?
 
Yeah he will never be that guy.

He's a crossing pattern, deep post, slant, wheel/go route type of WR but that is fine. Not everyone has to be a jump ball/outmatch you with physical dominance type WR.

He's highly effective at what he does, we just need to find him on the same routes deeper down the field.
I agree. One thing I never liked about the jump ball guys (those that are not great RAC players) is they go up, get the ball and then drop right down. You need a guy or two who can do that but I’d prefer a no 1 WR who can haul the ball in deep and jet to the EZ.
 
Not saying I don’t believe you. But would you post what you were looking at?
I can't even remember where I encountered that. It was on video/tv and since I work from home with the ability to have my TV/youtube on 95 percent of the time I watch a ton of stuff. I think the data come from one of those sites that people subscribe to and I haven't located it myself. If it had come from a site I frequent myself I'd have an easier time pulling it up for you.

But honestly, it should be clear to most just watching Waddle that he really doesn't get past or elude defenders.
 
There are only 2 players in the top 75 receivers who average less ypr than Waddle, Cole Beasley and Noah Fant, a TE. And it's not from lack of effort. He's been targeted like 75 times. It's hard to discern if it's just play design, QB play or Waddle lacking the lateral quickness and YAC ability everyone thought he had. He's not shown that Tyreek Hill/Marquise Brown skill set yet.
Lack of lateral quickness? It's the way they are using him. It's not that hard to understand.
 
All I need to know is opposing coaches and defense are paying special attention to him. He is averaging 6 receptions per game. He is living up to his draft pick.
 
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