What do we even have in Minkah? Was he ever a leader? | Page 7 | FinHeaven - Miami Dolphins Forums

What do we even have in Minkah? Was he ever a leader?

vcip said:
He is supposed to lead what exactly
if your work was looking to retool but said their new plan was to fail then put things in place fai lin epic fashion displaying zero competency, then replace any good worker with new employees that had no qualifications then decided that you yourself should be moved to window washer during the process from what you were hired for ... what would you lead?
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Leaders don't get to hand pick their followers. They lead who's there.
 
TedSlimmJr said:
I think people take Jim Nagy too literal. He's a bit of a hype machine and it's obvious why.

But like I said the other day - Minkah wanted out. He's just going about it the wrong way. I don't agree with the way he's going about it. But there's more leaders than just Minkah failing here, that's my point.

Once Minkah is gone, you still have a huge problem.
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I don’t buy the misuse or “coaches aren’t preparing me.”
Minkah is used to winning. His NJ team might’ve lost 2 games in his career. Same at BAMA. my opinion he doesn’t want to be on this 2-3 year rebuild.
Does that go to character? IDK. Maybe.
A friend of mine ran track at Bama and said the kid was a class act.
I would argue the great ones would take this as a challenge and be the foundation.
We shall see.
 
Lovethefish said:
I don’t buy the misuse or “coaches aren’t preparing me.”
Minkah is used to winning. His NJ team might’ve lost 2 games in his career. Same at BAMA. my opinion he doesn’t want to be on this 2-3 year rebuild.
Does that go to character? IDK. Maybe.
A friend of mine ran track at Bama and said the kid was a class act.
I would argue the great ones would take this as a challenge and be the foundation.
We shall see.
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I just think he needs to figure a few things out on his own. Mom and social media need to take a hike and let him work through it with his coaches and teammates.

Times like these can be opportunities for a kid like Minkah. He can become a man here and develop into one of those leaders that I said the coaches were going to find out - who can and who can't.

Everybody is going to find out. But I understand why he's confused. He wants to be a great player.
 
1. This situation is not unworkable. Offering him the opportunity to seek a trade is a step TOWARD reconciliation, not the opposite. He's unhappy, wanted to see if he could find a trade, and the Dolphins have told him alright if you can find someone that will meet our terms you can go ahead and seek that out, but otherwise they intend to keep Minkah through the end of his contract. If Minkah and his agent fail to find a trade, Miami can say we did our part. And Minkah, despite what you may think, is a football pro and he will do his part. He will study hard and play hard because that's what he does.

2. Tanking has serious human costs and you will see more consequences like this one. It's like gasoline being thrown on anything that might be smoldering under the surface. If you want to open the door to this tank business, reversing polarity in a league where every molecule seems oriented toward winning, you have to accept some NASTY consequences.

3. This clearly WAS something smoldering under the surface. Minkah Fitzpatrick has been complaining for two years under two coaching staffs about how he's being used. He's been doing it loudly and explicitly. His teammates aren't in love with him right now. I watched Xavien Howard have to be physically restrained from punching him during an 11-on-11 period of the Tampa joint practices. I've been told Minkah is "not one of the boys" in general. I've also been told the players are tired of him complaining, which he's been doing since the moment Flores arrived.

4. The Patriots have always operated a position-less defense. They ask their players to line up everywhere, seeking body type and skill set advantages based on situational football and offensive tendencies. Jonathan Jones, Duron Harmon, Devin McCourty, and Patrick Chung all played snaps from 21 discrete positions last year, including 11%, 20%, 31%, and 54% in the Box or on the DL, respectively. Judging by this game, Minkah's role was more proximal to Patrick Chung than Devin McCourty. But if he wants that Devin McCourty big contract some day, it's not a great look to be loudly b-tching and asking to be traded because you're closer to 50% in the box than 30% in the box.

5. Switching from the farcical Wide-9 "defense" (not actually a defense) to its polar opposite in the New England style of defense was always going to have casualties. Some players just don't like position-less defense. They have their own argument to make about it, and it's not valid or invalid, it just is. New England sifts through defensive players with high investment and low investment, constantly, to find the guys that embrace their way of playing defense. They traded for Cassius Marsh, who by all accounts was a high character, high work ethic player who should fit their approach like a glove, and they had to cut him within a few months because he had a severe allergic reaction to the way they do things. He badmouthed them afterwards, in the media and wherever he could, similar language as you're seeing from Minkah Fitzpatrick. On the other hand the Patriots traded for Kyle Van Noy and he absolutely loves the approach. We've already seen Vincent Taylor be a casualty to this transition, and we're seeing Raekwon McMillan be one as well. It's bloody and there will be more casualties, high and low.
 
ckparrothead said:
1. This situation is not unworkable. Offering him the opportunity to seek a trade is a step TOWARD reconciliation, not the opposite. He's unhappy, wanted to see if he could find a trade, and the Dolphins have told him alright if you can find someone that will meet our terms you can go ahead and seek that out, but otherwise they intend to keep Minkah through the end of his contract. If Minkah and his agent fail to find a trade, Miami can say we did our part. And Minkah, despite what you may think, is a football pro and he will do his part. He will study hard and play hard because that's what he does.

2. Tanking has serious human costs and you will see more consequences like this one. It's like gasoline being thrown on anything that might be smoldering under the surface. If you want to open the door to this tank business, reversing polarity in a league where every molecule seems oriented toward winning, you have to accept some NASTY consequences.

3. This clearly WAS something smoldering under the surface. Minkah Fitzpatrick has been complaining for two years under two coaching staffs about how he's being used. He's been doing it loudly and explicitly. His teammates aren't in love with him right now. I watched Xavien Howard have to be physically restrained from punching him during an 11-on-11 period of the Tampa joint practices. I've been told Minkah is "not one of the boys" in general. I've also been told the players are tired of him complaining, which he's been doing since the moment Flores arrived.

4. The Patriots have always operated a position-less defense. They ask their players to line up everywhere, seeking body type and skill set advantages based on situational football and offensive tendencies. Jonathan Jones, Duron Harmon, Devin McCourty, and Patrick Chung all played snaps from 21 discrete positions last year, including 11%, 20%, 31%, and 54% in the Box or on the DL, respectively. Judging by this game, Minkah's role was more proximal to Patrick Chung than Devin McCourty. But if he wants that Devin McCourty big contract some day, it's not a great look to be loudly b-tching and asking to be traded because you're closer to 50% in the box than 30% in the box.

5. Switching from the farcical Wide-9 "defense" (not actually a defense) to its polar opposite in the New England style of defense was always going to have casualties. Some players just don't like position-less defense. They have their own argument to make about it, and it's not valid or invalid, it just is. New England sifts through defensive players with high investment and low investment, constantly, to find the guys that embrace their way of playing defense. They traded for Cassius Marsh, who by all accounts was a high character, high work ethic player who should fit their approach like a glove, and they had to cut him within a few months because he had a severe allergic reaction to the way they do things. He badmouthed them afterwards, in the media and wherever he could, similar language as you're seeing from Minkah Fitzpatrick. On the other hand the Patriots traded for Kyle Van Noy and he absolutely loves the approach. We've already seen Vincent Taylor be a casualty to this transition, and we're seeing Raekwon McMillan be one as well. It's bloody and there will be more casualties, high and low.
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Absolutely. It's why I get so tired of hearing about coaching "grown men" in the NFL. Most of these guys are still kids heavily influenced by family and others around them until they grow out of it. Some never do. And they're making a lot of money.

Minkah wants to be a great player. But he has to understand he's not entitled to be a great player. Minkah is no different than the 5-star recruits coming in to programs all over the country that feel like they're entitled to be a great player instead of working to become one.

It's like Saban tells these kids all the time - everybody wants to be the beast, but nobody wants to do what the beast do.
 
TedSlimmJr said:
Absolutely. It's why I get so tired of hearing about coaching "grown men" in the NFL. Most of these guys are still kids heavily influenced by family and others around them until they grow out of it. Some never do. And they're making a lot of money.

Minkah wants to be a great player. But he has to understand he's not entitled to be a great player. Minkah is no different than the 5-star recruits coming in to programs all over the country that feel like they're entitled to be a great player instead of working to become one.

It's like Saban tells these kids all the time - everybody wants to be the beast, but nobody wants to do what the beast do.
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I agree with the above, it’s growing up time. I hope the staff and Minkah figure it out together. When the dust settles on this dumpster fire, we need veterans like Howard, Wilkins, Minkah to become the foundation of the franchise.
This was one of the primary reasons Wilkins and Minkah were priority picks.
It seems like Flores has the persona to manage the situation..
If it can’t, I’m unusually confident he won’t be traded for less than above market value.
 
Its easy to be a leader when its handed to you and things are going your way, like in college.

When the situation demands you perform to your perceived skill and capability, and you can't live up to the hype that you originally embraced, then we see what you are made of. Tom Brady took adversity and used it to develop his skillset into something special. In this case the Fitz is "on the Fritz" and is failing and flailing to go back to the way it was somewhere else. Some folks refer to that as trying to crawl back into the womb.

When the going gets tough, the tough get going. Millennial's don't understand that. They seem to think that means going someplace else to be like it used to be.
Maybe Sabin will hire him as a coach? :lmfao:

If all else fails he can at least fall back on his college degree and earn a living, can't he?
 
ckparrothead said:
That's pretty much what has happened.
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There are reports we'd accept a 2nd, I hope that's not true. As bad as he's looked where talking about the 11th pick in the 2018 draft who had an elite PFF grade (take it for what it's worth) for doing at least one thing last very well season.
 
DolfanISS said:
There are reports we'd accept a 2nd, I hope that's not true. As bad as he's looked where talking about the 11th pick in the 2018 draft who had an elite PFF grade (take it for what it's worth) for doing at least one thing last very well season.
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All I've seen is we want a 1st. Where have you seen a 2nd?
 
If the price is a 1 and a 2 then forget it he’s not going anywhere.

See ya Sunday kid
 
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