X Trade Offer Super Thread

[Jamesw]

You are missing the point, one guy produces on the field, the other is non existent....it's a no-brainer.

Ummm that’s just wrong. Jones was extremely solid and was a major factor in why X was able to reach 10 interceptions. QBs don’t target Jones’ side because his coverage is excellent., thus giving X more opportunities. And X played very well in tandem with Jones and had a banner year.

Both are quality, top tier CBs.

The issue, is that X is under contract, and doesn’t want to honor the very generous investment the Phins have made in him for the following reasons:
1. Greed. 2. New agent who wants more commission NOW. 3. Ego

 

[Beach Bum]

Keep Xavian Howard and trade Byron Jones. Why the hell would you trade a proven corner who produces and keep another who doesn't. They traded Minka FitzPatrick who turned out pretty good for the Steelers. Granted he wanted out, but this is different. Howard wants paid and I say pay the man and trade Jones and pay part of his salary.

With respect, there would be no way I would do this. It would send the wrong message in a variety of ways and probably destroy our team culture. It's clear X is the one that needs to go. He brought it on himself. Hopefully, Grier can get a decent return on our investment.

 

[Fin-Loco]

Kamera and a 1 please. Saints are players in the market for X according to their beat writers

Kamara AND a one makes what sense for the Saints? I mean I would love Kamara but they aren’t going to give up their 25 year old top offensive weapon AND a first. Realistically we’d have to do something like x plus a 4th for Kamara.

 

[nick1]

Kamara AND a one makes what sense for the Saints? I mean I would love Kamara but they aren’t going to give up their 25 year old top offensive weapon AND a first. Realistically we’d have to do something like x plus a 4th for Kamara.

If you want a top 5 corner you must pay a steep price right. A elite corner beats even the best RB by a good margin

 

[traptses]

If you want a top 5 corner you must pay a steep price right. A elite corner beats even the best RB by a good margin

I’m having a real tough time believing the Vikings trade prime Adrian Peterson AND a 1st, for Xavien Howard

 

[nick1]

I’m having a real tough time believing the Vikings trade prime Adrian Peterson AND a 1st, for Xavien Howard

At this point Howard wants out basically so maybe I could settle for X for Kamera straight up. I’d still want a 4th to go with Kamera

that was a different era. Can you show me when the last time a RB got a big return in a trade was? Ramsey got 2 firsts. It’s just the era we are in corners rule

 

[Mach2]

At this point Howard wants out basically so maybe I could settle for X for Kamera straight up. I’d still want a 4th to go with Kamera

that was a different era. Can you show me when the last time a RB got a big return in a trade was? Ramsey got 2 firsts. It’s just the era we are in corners rule

You inadvertently stumbled onto the reason we won't get a big haul for X. He wants out.

Much like X has no leverage with the Phins, the Phins have no leverage in trade negotiations.

Also, for reasons laid out many times already, X doesn't have the value of Ramsey at that time.

 

[GRYPHONK]

Jones had a very good SINGLE season as a CB with Dallas. Him making a bunch of tackles should be a red flag because his man is usually catching the ball...

Jones isn't an excellent player. He's a starting CB, along the lines of Levi Wallace.

Well, maybe on face value sure.

But when you look at actual numbers not so much.

Since Howard has decided to tell the world Byron Jones was overpaid and he deserves more money than him. Let's compare the two from 2016-2019. I don't count 2020 because Howard's beef was them making Jones a higher paid CB prior to last season. So this is to see if Howard has. Legitimate gripe.

Jones- 63 games played
Howard- 39 games played

Jones- Targeted 270 times
Howard- 210 times

During that time

Jones- targeted 4.3 times a game
Howard- targeted 5.3 times a game

During that time, it's clear teams targeted Howard more implying QBS stayed away from Jones more. Remember, this is also with Jones playing 24 more games which actually makes his stats that more impressive.

Jones- 160 catches allowed
Howard- 116 catches allowed

Jones- 59% completion against
Howard- 54% completion against.

That one is a slight victory to Howard.

Now to dispel the "red flag" comment.

Jones- 219 tackles
Howard- 116

Jones- 59 more tackles than receptions allowed.
Howard- 5 more tackles than receptions allowed.

You say red flag, others can say he is always around the ball and is more complete player. He doesn't just cover WRS like Howard. All Howard does is cover, he seems to not be involved unless it's his guy.

So far looks to me like they are pretty equal. Jones actually statistically was more reliable and a more overall player.

If Howard was a shut down corner, Jones was too. It wasn't a "single" very good season.

With all that said, Howard was CLEARLY the better playmaker.

Jones- 4 total turnovers caused
Howard- 13 total turnovers caused

Impressive considering 24 less games.

So in essence, the team paid a CB with similar "shut down" numbers, stats and capability, who on average, played 5 + more games a season, but was not the playmaker as Howard.

Levi Wallace? He appeared to be on Howard's level, minus the play making ability, but slightly superior in almost every other category.

 

[nick1]

You inadvertently stumbled onto the reason we won't get a big haul for X. He wants out.

Much like X has no leverage with the Phins, the Phins have no leverage in trade negotiations.

Also, for reasons laid out many times already, X doesn't have the value of Ramsey at that time.

I’m aware that he wants out or a new deal and that’s why he won’t get what Ramsey fetched. However Miami can still force him to sit and 10 interceptions is something rare in the nfl lately I think it has been a decade since anybody did that in a single season. Therefore X has value

 

[Mach2]

I’m aware that he wants out or a new deal and that’s why he won’t get what Ramsey fetched. However Miami can still force him to sit and 10 interceptions is something rare in the nfl lately I think it has been a decade since anybody did that in a single season. Therefore X has value

He has value, but take off the fan hat, and put on your GM from another team hat.

He wants a new contract, so if you trade a lot of assets for him, he has huge leverage in negotiations. You would have to be willing to give him top 3 (probobly) money, with substantial future gaurantees. That immediately brings us to his history of injury and missing large chunks of seasons.

There's a good reason teams aren't lining up to give us a big return in a trade.

 

[fansinceGWilson]

He has value, but take off the fan hat, and put on your GM from another team hat.

He wants a new contract, so if you trade a lot of assets for him, he has huge leverage in negotiations. You would have to be willing to give him top 3 (probobly) money, with substantial future gaurantees. That immediately brings us to his history of injury and missing large chunks of seasons.

There's a good reason teams aren't lining up to give us a big return in a trade.

I suspect a new contract between X and the new team would be agreed to before the trade deal happens. It's legal and the acquiring team, particularly one with limited cap would like to know the cost before making the trade. Still, I agree with your premise - the new team would be hesitant to give up big $ and top picks/players. Umm, unless BOB is on the phone

 

[nick1]

I suspect a new contract between X and the new team would be agreed to before the trade deal happens. It's legal and the acquiring team, particularly one with limited cap would like to know the cost before making the trade. Still, I agree with your premise - the new team would be hesitant to give up big $ and top picks/players. Umm, unless BOB is on the phone

I think the saints are very willing to trade for him, according to reports, and they are Wizards with the cap always seem to be over but they get themselves under. If they are willing to trade McCoy or Kamera I would do it

 

[SF Dolphin Fan]

I’m aware that he wants out or a new deal and that’s why he won’t get what Ramsey fetched. However Miami can still force him to sit and 10 interceptions is something rare in the nfl lately I think it has been a decade since anybody did that in a single season. Therefore X has value

I think Howard's value is at least a 1st round pick. Probably a 1st and a 3rd.

But Miami might be better off taking young players and less in terms of draft capital. The window is open for the Dolphins, which is why I like some of the proposals (rumors) that include players who can contribute in 2021.

 

[SF Dolphin Fan]

He has value, but take off the fan hat, and put on your GM from another team hat.

He wants a new contract, so if you trade a lot of assets for him, he has huge leverage in negotiations. You would have to be willing to give him top 3 (probobly) money, with substantial future gaurantees. That immediately brings us to his history of injury and missing large chunks of seasons.

There's a good reason teams aren't lining up to give us a big return in a trade.

Another reason players could be included as teams likely will have to clear salary.

 

[Feverdream]

Another reason players could be included as teams likely will have to clear salary.

I think this is very true, and since we'd be dumping 12M in salary, we'd be in a good place to take on a contract or two.