NY Daily News: Torre Out, Pinella In

[Boik14]

These past 2 seasons Joe Torre has done some of the best jobs he's done in his career with the Yankees. This year he weathered many storms and the Yankees not only won the division, they ran away with it. Last year Torre was missing his whole pitching staff for half the season (Wang, Wright, and Pavano) and still got the Yankees into the playoffs. Lou Pinella would have folded like a little girl in those positions. Lou Pinella might not have had the talent that Joe Torre has had, but let's face it, this isn't Bobby Cox, Tony LaRussa, or Tommy Lasorda, this is a guy who has won 4 division titles in 19 years as a manager (and 1 world series). What, because Lou Pinella yells and acts a fool that makes him a better manager then Joe Torre? You guys, like the boss are looking at Torre as the scapegoat. It's not right no matter how you cut it. The Yankees got screwed when they brought back Matsui and Sheffield and screwed the chemistry of the team up. This Yankees team changed when those 2 came back in the line-up. Instead of waiting for the 3 run homerun like they did the last 2 seasons the 2006 Yankees could run the bases, played smart defense, and HUSTLED. As soon as those 2 came back the team reverted back to it's old ways and this is the reason why they are in the situation they are in (although I love Matsui, don't get it twisted). Joe Torre got stuck because he had to play Sheff and Matsui because of how much money they make. In the end, this shouldn't fall on Joe Torre's head it should fall in the Bosses own head because every guy who failed for the Yankees big time in the post-season WERE ALL HIS IDEA. He personally wanted Jaret Wright (you guys know Cashman isn't that stupid), personally negotiated Gary Sheffield, personally wanted A-Rod (to piss Boston off), and personally wanted Randy Johnson (because he wanted Boston to see they got the 2nd best pitcher from Arizona's title team. We all know who the better pitcher is right now). The Boss needs to continue to let Joe and Cashman work this team back through the farm system, the young guys, and through smart trades and signings. They've had one year to do it so far and it worked solid. None of Torre's and Cash's guys failed, only the Boss's boys did. It's time for the Boss to continue to relax in Tampa and give Cashman and Torre more then 1 year of full charge without his interference to make this team their vision!


JUST SAY NO TO PINELLA!

I totally agree with this take. The Boss always goes for the high profile guy but if you look at the 90's NYY teams, the yankees got good when they had baseball men making the decisions like Bob Watson and Stick Michael. Watson worked the trade front and Michael ran the farm. Steinbrenner was suspended during part of that time.

Its proven though that whenever George has gone out and just gotten the gusy he wanted they failed. Mel Hall, jesse Barfield, Ed Whitson, and now you can add more names to the list.

Torre certainly does not deserve to be the fall guy. But ill tell ya what, if for whatever reason he is the fall guy, I hear there's a nice bench coach position available next to willie randolph! :D

 

[MikeO]

During the course of 162 games a manager decides very little, IMO. When it is a short series managers can make a difference just by knowing their team and the matchups. Torre is a good clubhouse guy from what i've heard but he still threw A-Rod under the bus with the SI article. Torre got the benefit of the doubt in the past and as an outsider looking in I think it's time the Yankees moved on. The guy was the manager of a team that blew a 3-0 lead in the ALCS and has lost in the 1st rd of the playoffs the last two seasons. Regardless of what they've done in the past their are very vew managers/coaches who could blow a 3-0 lead and then lose in the playoffs in the 1st rd the next two season and keep their job.

Joe threw AROD under the bus by batting him 8th in the lineup on Saturday. That was uncalled for.

Sheff wasn't good enough to play Friday night vs Kenny F'n Rogers......but on Saturday he is good enough to hit 4th??? Look at his postseason stats. They are on the same level as AROD the past few years. And you have AROD who has been there all year, who won the MVP last year......batting 8th.

Total lack of respect and he threw him under the bus!! Joe's emotions got the best of him. Now Joe must take the hit!

 

[MikeO]

In 1996 Joe had the balls to stand up to Tino and say, your benched. Im playing Cecil Fielder because right now he's better.

10 years later Joe DIDN'T have the balls to stand up to Sheff and say, your benched I need to play someone else.

That is why Joe will take the hit. On a team filled with SUPERSTARS if Joe can't stand up to them and do whats right, then he must go!

Joe is a good man. He's going to the HALL OF FAME!!! He deserves to be paid the final year of his deal. He has done a great job for 11 years. But he F'd up bigtime in this Detriot series. From Wang, to Sheff, to Mussina in Game 2. Joe has to take the hit on this. He won't be the only one, but he's gotta be one fo the guys taking the hit!

 

[nyjunc]

I disagree. Joe Torre has had the best team money can buy for the last 6 seasons and has not gotten it done. Regardless I don't think Joe Torre is a great in-game manager. Guys probably would like to see him stay but somebody has to be held accountable. A-Rod is one of the most talented guys in the game and bringing in Lou is not a move just to cater to A-Rod. I'm not sure how much of an upgrade that Lou is but it would be a change for the Yankees and sometimes that is needed. I believe Torre has one year left on his contract and why go through a season of players constantly being questioned about whether Joe will get another contract which is another distraction. Especially since the two lead candidates are available now and who knows if they'll be available next season?

He's had the most expensive team but not the best. In '01 and '03 we had excellent pitching and coincidentally we made the WS each time but ran into better and hotter pitchers in the WS. The other years the pitching wasn't great and our bats went cold. What is Torre supposed to do about that?

In 1996 Joe had the balls to stand up to Tino and say, your benched. Im playing Cecil Fielder because right now he's better.

10 years later Joe DIDN'T have the balls to stand up to Sheff and say, your benched I need to play someone else.

Actually he did, he sat him in Game 2 then Giambi in game 3. the problem is neither Sheff or Matsui earned their jobs back and neither should have been playing.

 

[UCFinfan86]

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=2618683

Looks like george is keeping torre, for now. I really don't understand how you can keep torre now, after everyone thought he was gone and alot of people are/were using him as sort of a scapegoat. I still believe he will be canned.

 

[MikeO]

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=2618683

Looks like george is keeping torre, for now. I really don't understand how you can keep torre now, after everyone thought he was gone and alot of people are/were using him as sort of a scapegoat. I still believe he will be canned.

he might be waiting to make the decision until its a big day for the Mets. To steal the backpages from them.

Just something to consider.

Who knows!

 

[UCFinfan86]

that is true, i didn't consider that. That would be a good way to steal the headline from the mets

 

[FinsNYanksFan13]

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=2618683

Looks like george is keeping torre, for now. I really don't understand how you can keep torre now, after everyone thought he was gone and alot of people are/were using him as sort of a scapegoat. I still believe he will be canned.

Uh, maybe he's keeping him because he's won 4 World Series, been to 6, and has won 9 straight division titles and been to the playoffs 11 years out of 11. That's a pretty good reason to keep a manager, don't you think?

 

[UCFinfan86]

Uh, maybe he's keeping him because he's won 4 World Series, been to 6, and has won 9 straight division titles and been to the playoffs 11 years out of 11. That's a pretty good reason to keep a manager, don't you think?

ok i wasn't talking about his accomplishments, :shakeno: i never thought he should have gotten rid of him in the first place. But when every sports channel and media outlet is saying torre is fired and multiple sources pretty much confirmed that he was fired and now your going to say your not firing him?

 

[FinsNYanksFan13]

ok i wasn't talking about his accomplishments, :shakeno: i never thought he should have gotten rid of him in the first place. But when every sports channel and media outlet is saying torre is fired and multiple sources pretty much confirmed that he was fired and now your going to say your not firing him?

Well he still may be fired but hopefull he isn't and the Boss was just reacting emotionally and not with his thoughts. Seriously, I stated this above and I will again.....the Bosses guys failed. I know it's going to be tough for him to admit that but it's the truth. Hopefully he's realized that and has realized that Cashman and Torre have this boat headed in the right direction and hopefully the Boss gives them more then one year to make their visions a reality!

 

[UCFinfan86]

Well he still may be fired but hopefull he isn't and the Boss was just reacting emotionally and not with his thoughts. Seriously, I stated this above and I will again.....the Bosses guys failed. I know it's going to be tough for him to admit that but it's the truth. Hopefully he's realized that and has realized that Cashman and Torre have this boat headed in the right direction and hopefully the Boss gives them more then one year to make their visions a reality!

He will never admit it publicly and i doubt that he think its his fault. I think if the yankees don't win george thinks someone must of ****ed up, so he has to find someone and replace them, and i guess the easiest choice this year is torre. Although i agree in reality it was his, but he will never admit that.

 

[MikeO]

Uh, maybe he's keeping him because he's won 4 World Series, been to 6, and has won 9 straight division titles and been to the playoffs 11 years out of 11. That's a pretty good reason to keep a manager, don't you think?

or maybe they want AROD gone. They feel moving AROD is the only way to get a good young pitcher. And by bringing in Lou.......AROD probably stays.

So, keep Joe for the final year of his contract.......trade AROD.

Then you can get Lou a year from now

 

[unifiedtheory]

or maybe they want AROD gone. They feel moving AROD is the only way to get a good young pitcher. And by bringing in Lou.......AROD probably stays.

So, keep Joe for the final year of his contract.......trade AROD.

Then you can get Lou a year from now

It's looking like that (trading A-Rod and keeping Joe) is going to happen.

It's early but I see A-Rod in Anaheim next year and I DO NOT like that at ALL. He'll be relaxed and right back to .320, 40+ HR, 130 RBI and give the Angels the bat they need.

 

[MikeO]

It's looking like that (trading A-Rod and keeping Joe) is going to happen.

It's early but I see A-Rod in Anaheim next year and I DO NOT like that at ALL. He'll be relaxed and right back to .320, 40+ HR, 130 RBI and give the Angels the bat they need.

Before NY goes to LAA.........they are going to try and move him to EVERY NL team. NY will want him out of the AL if they can.

If not, then LA is the most likely AL team. They need a big bat. They need someone for 3B. They have the young arms and Figgins (who can play 3B for NY). It makes sense. But NY will try with every NL team first.

 

[UCFinfan86]

Mikeo do you think that if Lou doesn't get the NY job this year, he will sign with another team this season??