Ross donates $200 million to University of Michigan

[MD]

Good for Ross, and he can choose to donate his money anywhere he wants to. Anyone who was against the stadium proposal and faults Ross for this donation is a hypocrite. You can't argue against Ross wanting public help for the stadium renovations then turn around and bash him for what he is doing with his money. If you don't want him telling you what to do with your money, you can't tell him what he can do with his.

Plus another big complaint was that the "tax" money should be going towards education and not stadium renovations. Ross' donation to Michigan is all about supporting education.

Half is for the business school and the other half is for the athletic department.

 

[Zounds]

I think there's a lot of childishness going on in this thread.

I just expected a lot of "Nice going Ross!" comments about what he did, but instead I see comments about how he is money grubbing from the state and local municipalities to feed his own greed, and comments about how his heart inst in Miami or that this is some grand scheme to sell the team. Yea, its childish.

 

[Vaark]

I think there's a lot of white washing going on here.

Steve Ross wanted stadium upgrades that would have benefited him financially. The stadium upgrades would have provided more revenue for him, and would have stabilized the value of the franchise he owns (which has failed to appreciate in the five years he's owned the team, whereas the equities market is up about 80% over the same time period).

Ross argued that the stadium upgrades also would have been a public good because it would have brought Super Bowls to South Florida. Therefore, the public should share in the cost of the upgrades in order to pay for this public good. Steve Ross priced the amount of the public good that the stadium upgrades would have done at about $200 million. That's the amount he wanted the public to pay because it would have been a public good. For him to pay the entire bill of the stadium upgrades, he would have been in essence "donating" $200 million to the city of Miami, in his eyes.

The city and state rejected his bid for public financing. As a result he's giving that $200 million to the University of Michigan.

The Dolphins have an absentee owner who lives in New York and is rarely "in the office" down in Miami, a man who gives more in charitable donations and goodwill to the University of Michigan than to anything connected with the city of Miami, a man who once tried to buy the New York Jets and who owned a USFL team in Philadelphia.

His heart is clearly not in Miami. I'm not saying there's anything wrong with that. It is what it is.

My theory is that with the Dolphins turning out to be such a bad investment, and with his heart clearly not being with the city and with the team, selling his stake in the team to someone else and cutting his losses (or failure to gain anything) is inevitable.

Nice narrative -however Ross grew up and graduated from high school in North Miami as a Fins fan, has a mansion in, and is part of the Palm Beach Society. How do you know he didn't approach the Garbageman before trying to purchase the jest as a business investment. Whatever teams or investments he purchases as a successful businessman is not an indictment on how he feels about the Fins. He didn't grow so wealthy making imprudent investments. Obviously The Garbageman left a mess - still Ross paid close to top dollar which indicates to me it was a "labor of love" buying his favorite team. :up:

So don't try to depict him as another Norman Braman, one of the most hated men in Philly as a terrible Eagles owner who drove Reggie White to GB . Braman was a carpetbagger who could give a **** about the team he owned, and lived in Miami and France while owning it.

 

[MRojas4]

Nice narrative -however Ross grew up and graduated from high school in North Miami as a Fins fan, has a mansion in, and is part of the Palm Beach Society. How do you know he didn't approach the Garbageman before trying to purchase the jest as a business investment. Whatever teams or investments he purchases as a successful businessman is not an indictment on how he feels about the Fins. He didn't grow so wealthy making imprudent investments. Obviously The Garbageman left a mess - still Ross paid close to top dollar which indicates to me it was a "labor of love" buying his favorite team. :up:

So don't try to depict him as another Norman Braman, one of the most hated men in Philly as a terrible Eagles owner who drove Reggie White to GB . Braman was a carpetbagger who could give a **** about the team he owned, and lived in Miami and France while owning it.

Wow wow.....

A Vaark post I don't need a dictionary for? This is madness!

:kick:

 

[ckparrothead]

Nice narrative -however Ross grew up and graduated from high school in North Miami as a Fins fan, has a mansion in, and is part of the Palm Beach Society. How do you know he didn't approach the Garbageman before trying to purchase the jest as a business investment. Whatever teams or investments he purchases as a successful businessman is not an indictment on how he feels about the Fins. He didn't grow so wealthy making imprudent investments. Obviously The Garbageman left a mess - still Ross paid close to top dollar which indicates to me it was a "labor of love" buying his favorite team. :up:

So don't try to depict him as another Norman Braman, one of the most hated men in Philly as a terrible Eagles owner who drove Reggie White to GB . Braman was a carpetbagger who could give a **** about the team he owned, and lived in Miami and France while owning it.

I never brought up Norman Braman. You did.

He has a home in Miami. That makes sense, since he owns the Dolphins and all. But how often is he in that home? Because several reports have him in New York year-round as an all-but absentee owner. And your defending his attempt to buy the Jets before the Dolphins on the basis of "what if"? What if he tried to own the Dolphins before he tried to own the Jets? No I don't know if he tried to own the Dolphins before he tried to own the Jets. But there's absolutely no basis for that speculation. Not even a hint.

Nothing I said is incorrect. I laid out facts. He's an absentee owner that lives and works in New York, tried to buy the Jets before buying the Dolphins, and owned a USFL team in Philadelphia. You say, why should I fault him for trying to make smart business acquisitions such as the USFL team in Philly. I say, how do you know he didn't regard the Miami Dolphins as the same exact thing?

 

[TheWalrus]

I think there's a lot of childishness going on in this thread.

Small wonder, considering some of the participants.

I personally am not bothered by this move by Ross, by the way. If giving that money to the University of Michigan means he's given up improving the stadium, that's a good thing over the long term. He's never shown any instinct on doing what's smart or necessary with the stadium, so it's time we just wait for the next owner to come in and hope he blows the damn thing up instead rather than engaging in shameless and half assed attempts at patching the hole on the USS Minnow.

I just assumed we would have to wait for Ross to die but if he's thinking of selling now, then that's even better. The worst parting gift he could have given the fanbase was to ensure we'd be in that dump for another 15 years.

 

[scottie g]

I never brought up Norman Braman. You did.

He has a home in Miami. That makes sense, since he owns the Dolphins and all. But how often is he in that home? Because several reports have him in New York year-round as an all-but absentee owner. And your defending his attempt to buy the Jets before the Dolphins on the basis of "what if"? What if he tried to own the Dolphins before he tried to own the Jets? No I don't know if he tried to own the Dolphins before he tried to own the Jets. But there's absolutely no basis for that speculation. Not even a hint.

Nothing I said is incorrect. I laid out facts. He's an absentee owner that lives and works in New York, tried to buy the Jets before buying the Dolphins, and owned a USFL team in Philadelphia. You say, why should I fault him for trying to make smart business acquisitions such as the USFL team in Philly. I say, how do you know he didn't regard the Miami Dolphins as the same exact thing?

I agree , ross trys to buy teams as an investment (probably the dolphins too ) . I don't think hes like someone like jerry jones , a big time fan , who buys his beloveth team and trys to make them bigger than life .

 

[Vaark]

I never brought up Norman Braman. You did.

He has a home in Miami. That makes sense, since he owns the Dolphins and all. But how often is he in that home? Because several reports have him in New York year-round as an all-but absentee owner. And your defending his attempt to buy the Jets before the Dolphins on the basis of "what if"? What if he tried to own the Dolphins before he tried to own the Jets? No I don't know if he tried to own the Dolphins before he tried to own the Jets. But there's absolutely no basis for that speculation. Not even a hint.

Nothing I said is incorrect. I laid out facts. He's an absentee owner that lives and works in New York, tried to buy the Jets before buying the Dolphins, and owned a USFL team in Philadelphia. You say, why should I fault him for trying to make smart business acquisitions such as the USFL team in Philly. I say, how do you know he didn't regard the Miami Dolphins as the same exact thing?

Trying to buy the jets when they were available does not mean he didn't graduate from N. Miami Beach high school - a few miles from the Orange Bowl...or grow up rooting as a lifelong Fins fan. He has held Romney fund raisers in his W Palm Mansion for his fellow floridian socialites. Owning an 11 thousand sq foot mansion in West Palm that he doesn't use is a stretch. As one of the 3 biggest movers and shakers in NY real estate, of course he's gonna have his primary residence there. Again that does not indicate he didn't and doesnt have deep ties to South Florida or doesn't give a crap about the Fins franchise beyond its intrinsic investment value. Ralph Wilson has owned Buffalo for how long? Did he ever live there instead of Detroit? Bud Adams owns the Titans but lives in Houston. Shahid Khan owns the Jags but lives in Champaigne IL. Does that make them carpetbaggers? Actually Ross has more of a natural tie to So Florida than the fore-mentioned off the top of my head and likely a bunch more abstentee owners. Hell, George Steinbrenner one of the most revolutionary owners changing major league BB lived in Tampa. Mark Cuban took a shot at the Cubs and the Dodgers while living in Dallas. No one is gonna persuade me that he wouldn't have upgraded both those teams. Sorry but that's a non issue.

I brought up Braman cause he is a self serving POS who actually did harm in a myriad of ways to the Eagles while carpetbagging. He epitomizes what an abstentee owner is, and ironically is the hypocritical ******* who's a thorn in the Fins side. To say that Ross is an absentee owner with only a pecuniary shallow interest in the Fins does him a disservice.

 

[ckparrothead]

Small wonder, considering some of the participants.

I personally am not bothered by this move by Ross, by the way. If giving that money to the University of Michigan means he's given up improving the stadium, that's a good thing over the long term. He's never shown any instinct on doing what's smart or necessary with the stadium, so it's time we just wait for the next owner to come in and hope he blows the damn thing up instead rather than engaging in shameless and half assed attempts at patching the hole on the USS Minnow.

I just assumed we would have to wait for Ross to die but if he's thinking of selling now, then that's even better. The worst parting gift he could have given the fanbase was to ensure we'd be in that dump for another 15 years.

I honestly don't really care what he does with his money. It's his money. He should do what he feels is best with it. I've never indicated otherwise.

I'm just calling a spade a spade. He refused to pay for 100% of the stadium upgrades, even though the upgrades would benefit his holdings financially, because he knew that the city of Miami would enjoy a public good from those upgrades and he did not want them to enjoy a free ride. Then he turns around and gives about the same money as he wanted from the city of Miami to the University of Michigan, even though he gets no financial gain from anything the University of Michigan does.

He looks at the city of Miami as a moocher trying to get a free ride, and he looks on the University of Michigan like a doting grandfather to be showered with (very expensive) gifts.

That's fine. I have no problem with that. It's his choice. You can't just MAKE an owner love the city that is home to the sports franchise he owns.

However, I do have a problem with this in one very specific, particular way. I would like to see those stadium upgrades done, one way or another. Whether it's public financing or private financing, I would like to see the upgrades done. The cartel that is the NFL seems pretty adamant that there must be public financing for this sort of venture, and there's a lot of peer pressure involved in that. He could pay for things himself, but the peer pressure makes it less likely, IMO. So the easiest way to get this done would be to convince the public to help with the financing. But the optics on this donation are so poor, it leaves so many people with such a bad taste in their mouth, that Steve Ross has actually damaged his ability to revisit the public financing issue at some later date. This is the primary problem I had with his vindictive, ill advised public political vendetta he's decided to carry out with his political action committee. In the end, I feel these are all scorched earth tactics that aren't going to benefit anyone. Not himself, not Miami fans, not the city of Miami, nobody.

And that I do kind of have a problem with. I would prefer more efficient means of getting things done.

 

[TheWalrus]

I honestly don't really care what he does with his money. It's his money. He should do what he feels is best with it. I've never indicated otherwise.

I'm just calling a spade a spade. He refused to pay for 100% of the stadium upgrades, even though the upgrades would benefit his holdings financially, because he knew that the city of Miami would enjoy a public good from those upgrades and he did not want them to enjoy a free ride. Then he turns around and gives about the same money as he wanted from the city of Miami to the University of Michigan, even though he gets no financial gain from anything the University of Michigan does.

He looks at the city of Miami as a moocher trying to get a free ride, and he looks on the University of Michigan like a doting grandfather to be showered with (very expensive) gifts.

That's fine. I have no problem with that. It's his choice. You can't just MAKE an owner love the city that is home to the sports franchise he owns.

However, I do have a problem with this in one very specific, particular way. I would like to see those stadium upgrades done, one way or another. Whether it's public financing or private financing, I would like to see the upgrades done. The cartel that is the NFL seems pretty adamant that there must be public financing for this sort of venture, and there's a lot of peer pressure involved in that. He could pay for things himself, but the peer pressure makes it less likely, IMO. So the easiest way to get this done would be to convince the public to help with the financing. But the optics on this donation are so poor, it leaves so many people with such a bad taste in their mouth, that Steve Ross has actually damaged his ability to revisit the public financing issue at some later date. This is the primary problem I had with his vindictive, ill advised public political vendetta he's decided to carry out with his political action committee. In the end, I feel these are all scorched earth tactics that aren't going to benefit anyone. Not himself, not Miami fans, not the city of Miami, nobody.

And that I do kind of have a problem with. I would prefer more efficient means of getting things done.

And therein lies the chief difference. If you're in favor of stadium upgrades, this is obviously another in a long chain of bad news as the result of idiotic planning. I personally think we passed the point of no return on that a while back, but it certainly doesn't help.

But if you think we need a new stadium, then in a byzantine way this is sort of a good thing, since it might possibly indicate, as you say, that Ross is getting to the point where he's ready to sell. The next owner, whoever he is, will get a fresh start and have the opportunity to do what Ross was never even willing to consider, which is to actually fix the problem with a new stadium rather than patching the old one. Partial public financing could be breached again under the right circumstances, imo.

 

[Zounds]

He refused to pay for 100% of the stadium upgrades, even though the upgrades would benefit his holdings financially,

The state of FL also refused to pay for part of the upgrades, even though the upgrades would be to their economic benefit. A very simple concept: if both parties should reap the benefits, then both parties should share some costs. Its a precedent set around the world. Stadiums, performing arts centers, amusement parks - almost all are joint ventures of some sort.

 

[ckparrothead]

The state of FL also refused to pay for part of the upgrades, even though the upgrades would be to their economic benefit. A very simple concept: if both parties should reap the benefits, then both parties should share some costs. Its a precedent set around the world. Stadiums, performing arts centers, amusement parks - almost all are joint ventures of some sort.

What a perfect way to encapsulate all the reasons why one should never donate any money to a school or charity. No benefits without pay, after all.

 

[ckparrothead]

Let's say I have two sons. Let's also say I have houses in New York and Miami. I live in Miami most of the year, except for the summer because let's be honest it's hot and humid and gross down there during the summer.

So I need someone to live in that house in Miami and actively take care of it during the summer, otherwise all kinds of bad things could happen (all the normal reasons people have other people house-sit vacant houses for them). But I don't have the time to rent it out to some stranger and be their landlord during the period, nor do I feel like I can trust a stranger.

One of my sons lives in Miami. As it happens, he needs a place to stay for the summer. If I did have time to play landlord and rent the place out, I know that I could get $3000 for the summer if I were renting it out. My son can't afford that, though. He wants to rent the place for free.

If I did this, I would enjoy all the benefits of having a house sitter I could trust. I wouldn't have to worry about break-ins, squatters, turning utilities off and then on again, invading critters, my landscaping wouldn't get out of control leading to HOA complaints, etc.

On the other hand, my son would be paying $0 for something I know is worth $3000 to him. So, I decide to let the house go vacant, because I can't stand the idea of my son getting $3000 worth of benefit for free, even if it mutually benefits me.

Is that a problem? Not inherently. It's my choice. Maybe I want to teach him a lesson, that nothing is for free. He's got to pay his own way.

But then what if I turn around and buy my other son a $3000 laptop?

There's nothing inherently bad about what I just did. It's my choice. But it does show how I feel about one son versus the other son, and there's no use pretending it doesn't.

 

[veejax]

Must be nice to have that much disposable income. Nice gesture by him.

 

[Zounds]

What a perfect way to encapsulate all the reasons why one should never donate any money to a school or charity. No benefits without pay, after all.

There's a huge difference in giving a handout to education, than doing a joint venture for entertainment. If you really think there are equivalent values there, then you have your values backwards.