History not working in Ginn's favor

[FinfanInBuffalo]

My takes on our moves this year.

Porter solid player too much guaranteed money. Perhaps
Did not sign or trade for any significant OL upgrades. That remains to be seen. It depends on how the new guys play.
Relying too much on a TE that has been injury prone and done very little, no backup plan in case his history repeats itself which is very possible. Agree. But McMichael was not living up to the hype either.
Hate the idea of aquiring a 37 year old Qb for a draft pick a concussed one coming off a bad year to top that off. If he plays well, nobody will care that he had a concussion last year.
Not addressing the oline enough in the draft At best they could have taken OL instead of Booker. Nobody good enough to take at #9. QB was a must at #40. Would an lineman in the third have changed your outlook that much?

Took too many chances in the draft with the Qb position, if Beck was thier man we got him by pure luck because we could have easily missed drafting him and even though i think Ginn could be real good would rather have addressed Qb there and still got a good receiver in the second round. This objection I don't understand. Why knock the team for getting the guys they wanted?

Cut one expensive kicker and replaced him with just as expensive a kicker. Obviously they feel Feeley is better.
Best move of the year convincing NE to give up so much for Welker.
Change the whole OL around again, just as we were getting some cohesion and decent play from our RT. I'm also getting tired of the yearly change at OL.


i'm not as optimistic as some because I don't think the moves we have made
give me such a reason to be. I'm just a very realistic fan and will not like a move just because my team does it. i don't think players are better just because they are on my team, i root for them and am glad when they do well but there is a differance. i want to be optimistic I do, I just see very little evidence why I should be. I'ma dolphin fan to the end but I will not try to act like my team is better than they are.

I think the Fins have a chance to be better than last year for two simple reasons - the offensive philosophy and play calling will make sense and the play of the QB should be better. They may not have a better record than last year because of the schedule, but they should be less painful to watch on offense.

 

[bigballin2987]

apparently you missed his 4 years of highlights at Ohio state:rolleyes2

apparently we all did since he was only at Ohio State for 3 years. :rolleyes2

 

[jdang307]

I got my original numbers from an apparently messed up EPSN site (http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/player/profile?playerId=133634)

Add in Ginn's rushing and return TDs and he has 25 career TDs as well. Ginn's best year was 59 receptions. Holmes' best year was 55 receptions.

Compare them anyway you want, BUT nobody is seriously doubting Holmes or Gonzalez (which was the point), so why are so many people doubting Ginn? It makes no sense at all.

While being a much more raw receiver. I haven't researched Holme's football history, was he a receiver in High School? Remember, Ginn put up comparable to Holmes' and Gonzales numbers while being raw as hell. If he only ran 3 routes (don't believe this, but if true) imagine what happens when we actually teach him something.

 

[bigballin2987]

While being a much more raw receiver. I haven't researched Holme's football history, was he a receiver in High School? Remember, Ginn put up comparable to Holmes' and Gonzales numbers while being raw as hell. If he only ran 3 routes (don't believe this, but if true) imagine what happens when we actually teach him something.

Holmes was always a wide receiver. His senior year he had 33 receptions for 970 yards and 10 touchdowns as a senior and was the MVP of the Outback Steakhouse All-Star Game with five receptions for 121 yards and a TD. He also played in the California-Florida All-Star Game

 

[jdang307]

His senior year he had 33 receptions for 970 yards and 10 touchdowns as a senior and was the MVP of the Outback Steakhouse All-Star Game with five receptions for 121 yards and a TD. He also played in the California-Florida All-Star Game

For a second there when you said senior I thought you were going into his college stats until I read 33 catches for 970 yards LOL. I'm like dayumn 30ypc average at OSU?

But yeah this shows Ginn put up very respectable if not damn good numbers for being raw. Being raw means one of two things, one he might never "get it" and translate to success in the NFL, or Two, sky's the limit. (I'm thinking the latter man he has moves and speed!)

 

[bigballin2987]

For a second there when you said senior I thought you were going into his college stats until I read 33 catches for 970 yards LOL. I'm like dayumn 30ypc average at OSU?

But yeah this shows Ginn put up very respectable if not damn good numbers for being raw. Being raw means one of two things, one he might never "get it" and translate to success in the NFL, or Two, sky's the limit. (I'm thinking the latter man he has moves and speed!)

I will agree with you there. A few of these reasons have already been documented on here. I think it is very important to understand the system he was in. Tressel is a very conservative coach, and I don't think Ginn's play making ability is in question here. His durability is not an issue for anyone with actually either following the kid, or doing less than 5 minutes of research. He is a very hard worker, and can go nowhere but up.

 

[tyson22]

apparently we all did since he was only at Ohio State for 3 years. :rolleyes2

semantics:rolleyes2 i think my point still stands since i was responding to this...

Ginn defenders will not take this criticism lightly. Have you not seen Ginn's high school video highlights? The guy was unbelievable. And if high school video highlights isn't the best predictor of NFL success, then nobody knows nothing. Hah!

im fairly certain that 99% of the posters on this board have no idea what ted ginn did in high school and are "predicting his NFL success" based on what they saw at ohio state and not high school. i will be a "ginn defender" if i need to be categorized one way or the other and i dont know anything about his high school video highlights.

 

[Phanatical]

I can't believe how many people here miss the entire point of the article. Here is the thesis right at the beginning:

"The real question, however, isn't whether Hester (GINN) can make a significant contribution on that side of the football. It's whether he'll still be able to produce those breathtaking returns that made him a Pro Bowler during his rookie season in the NFL. (or wether GINN he'll be able to make those breathtaking returns that made him spectacular at Ohio State). After all, it's hard enough to be an electrifying return man in this league (NFL). To do it year after year, well, that's proven to be fairly difficult for most players" (emphasis added).

The article then goes on to show how short lived these breathtaking return careers were. There were very few posts in this thread that addressed that issue. Most wanted to justify Ginn's WR numbers which weren't really in dispute, and which by the way, weren't so spectacular and were thrashed by lower draft picks like Johnny Lee Higgins. Anyway, getting back on topic, I think that CK did a pretty good job and made some good points, and a few others, but by and large most missed the entire point of the article. Ah well, homerism and blind support is alive and well in finheaven. :evil: JUST KIDDING. Seriously, I hope Ginn recovers from his injuries and tears up the NFL I just think it was a very risky move drafting him at #9 and the Phins with all their needs (Like a LT) needed some safer moves.

GO PHINS~!

 

[Crash_Jensen]

Once again the aqua colored goggles are out.

For those say Ginn is comparable to Howard and Brown at the same point in their careers, let me just say you guys are nuts.
Both guys won Heismans, and were completely dominant in college FB. Ginn is not in the same discussion as far as College career.

Also those saying what a great College reciever Ginn is (Better than Holmes lol) did not watch a whole lot of Big 10 football the past couple years. The guys is as raw a WR talent as there was in this draft. Returner, sure throw him in. WR, better give this guy 3-5 years to learn the position.

 

[dlockz]

Once again the aqua colored goggles are out.

For those say Ginn is comparable to Howard and Brown at the same point in their careers, let me just say you guys are nuts.
Both guys won Heismans, and were completely dominant in college FB. Ginn is not in the same discussion as far as College career.

Also those saying what a great College reciever Ginn is (Better than Holmes lol) did not watch a whole lot of Big 10 football the past couple years. The guys is as raw a WR talent as there was in this draft. Returner, sure throw him in. WR, better give this guy 3-5 years to learn the position.

I say Ginn is somewhat comparable to Howard although is much rawer as a receiver. I think thier NFL potential was similar at this point but Howard was much more dominant in college.

 

[Always Next Year]

Ginn vs Hester is a poor comparison. Hester was a good returner in college who was never able to play any position well enough to become a regular starter while he was at Miami. Ginn was a good returner in college who, while still unpolished at WR, was a gamebreaker on offense who had large parts of the offense tailored directly to his talents.

The thing people seem to miss about Ginn is that he is a "football player"; and no, I am not stating the obvious fact that his occupation is to play professional football. Ginn is a guy like Troy Brown or even the former Phin Wes Welker, he is the type of guy that just "get's it" when it comes to the game of football. This is likely the result of his father being a well respected high school coach, guys that are coaches kids often learn to play the game the way it's meant to be played and have a deep understanding of the game. Ginn is the kind of guy you can line up at most any skill position and make some things happen. In high school he played QB, RB, WR, CB, S, KR and PR. While he was at OSU he played mostly WR, but also had special plays drawn up specifically for him at QB and RB to take advantage of his abilities, and of course he excelled at KR and PR. When watching his many highlight reels I noticed how many different places I saw Ginn line up and how many different ways the team tried to get the ball into his hands; that to me shows that Ginn is a BIG PART of his teams gameplan on a WEEK TO WEEK basis. That fact speaks volumes for his ability on a football field.

Another thing about Ginn is the speed. Hester is a fast guy, but there are a lot of "fast guys" in the NFL. Ginn is a guy who has RARE speed. His speed is special, it is "freakish" in nature, it is the kind of speed that will be on the mind of any defensive coordinator as they set their game plan for us. It's not just the top end speed either, the way he gets to top speed so quickly is really fun to watch. Wait until you see him running past guys you used to think were "fast guys".

Just like EVERY OTHER player drafted this year, we don't know exactly how Ginn will do in the NFL, but the best predictor of future performance is past performance. I, for one, like a lot of the things I have seen from Ginn so far.

Hate to repost, but there were a couple of points I wanted to re-emphasize. (highlighted)

A guy like Ginn has many facets to his athletic ability and football skill set, he can be used in so many different situations that it is very difficult to find a viable comparison. From the speed, to the return ability, to the receiving ability, to the running ability, to the many different places from which he can affect a game.

This guy is going to be special, just wait and see.

 

[Always Next Year]

im fairly certain that 99% of the posters on this board have no idea what ted ginn did in high school and are "predicting his NFL success" based on what they saw at ohio state and not high school. i will be a "ginn defender" if i need to be categorized one way or the other and i dont know anything about his high school video highlights.

Dude, check this out, it's pretty sick.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sOMKfvexxU4

First few minutes start out OK, but it gets better and better.

First time I watched this I thought about that movie with Johnny Knoxville were he pretends to be "special" so he can compete in the Special Olympics. If they had a "special" football league, and some super fast normal dude got in somehow, I think this is what it would look like.

 

[FinfanInBuffalo]

Also those saying what a great College reciever Ginn is (Better than Holmes lol) did not watch a whole lot of Big 10 football the past couple years. The guys is as raw a WR talent as there was in this draft. Returner, sure throw him in. WR, better give this guy 3-5 years to learn the position.

What is it that you don't get? Ginn put up comparable numbers at WR as two other 1st round picks. Some feel he was the WR that drew coverage away from the other WRs at Ohio State. In addition, he can ALSO return kicks and punts. Why is Ginn getting all the doubt?

3-5 years to learn the position? Stop pretending he didn't play WR in college. Get real. By his 2nd year, he'll be starting and be a game changer.

 

[Phanatical]

What is it that you don't get? Ginn put up comparable numbers at WR as two other 1st round picks. Some feel he was the WR that drew coverage away from the other WRs at Ohio State. In addition, he can ALSO return kicks and punts. Why is Ginn getting all the doubt?

3-5 years to learn the position? Stop pretending he didn't play WR in college. Get real. By his 2nd year, he'll be starting and be a game changer.

See post #68.

http://www.finheaven.com/boardvb2/showpost.php?p=1062084902&postcount=68

 

[Phanatical]

Hate to repost, but there were a couple of points I wanted to re-emphasize. (highlighted)

A guy like Ginn has many facets to his athletic ability and football skill set, he can be used in so many different situations that it is very difficult to find a viable comparison. From the speed, to the return ability, to the receiving ability, to the running ability, to the many different places from which he can affect a game.

This guy is going to be special, just wait and see.

See post #68.

http://www.finheaven.com/boardvb2/showpost.php?p=1062084902&postcount=68