OFFENSIVE LINE IS OUR #1 WEAKNESS

[cuzinvinny]

The O Line is HUGELY important, but the cap exists.

So, your best long term bet will always be to build through the draft with some targeted bargain hunting.

Yes, I thought we'd try harder to sign Andrews, but ultimately, Center is one of those cheaper positions, and the team evidently thought that it was unwise to spend a large % of the cap on a Center. I'm not sure that I don't agree with that.

I'm VERY high on Jackson and Hunt. High on Eichenberg, and think Kindley should be jag, at least.

Honestly, I'm less convinced about Tua, and am not sure that he's ready to lead us deeply into the playoffs, so I'm willing to wait a year before spending big on a lineman. If Tua convinces me that he's good enough, then we have a LOT of cap next year to sign whoever we want.

Very reasonable approach and I understand though don't necessarily agree with it.
I'm high on our young OL too just not necessarily thinking that there time is better being now for the team. I mean look you got Hunt as one of experience veteran, what, going on year 2......not even got to year 2 yet.

We have the finances and more important the Need. Ya, we want it now ! But lets not forget we've been waiting around and have been dealing with stupidity for over 20 YEARS especially with the OL...

Tired too of all the rediculous pressure put on Tua. We're so lucking we got him...

 

[bradmcnutt13]

To start signed a top shelf Center and would have been zeroing in on Corey Linsley

Linsley is the one big miss that I felt we made, but there's only one of him and it just didn't happen. I don't understand the Jackson hate. I thought he played pretty well for a rookie and there's no reason to think that his future isn't bright. The other guys had their moments and we'll just have to wait and see if they continue to progress. They don't all need to make some gigantic leap; just get better.

 

[Feverdream]

Very reasonable approach and I understand though don't necessarily agree with it.
I'm high on our young OL too just not necessarily thinking that there time is better being now for the team. I mean look you got Hunt as one of experience veteran, what, going on year 2......not even got to year 2 yet.

We have the finances and more important the Need. Ya, we want it now ! But lets not forget we've been waiting around and have been dealing with stupidity for over 20 YEARS especially with the OL...

Tired too of all the rediculous pressure put on Tua. We're so lucking we got him...

Now that's fair.

You've expressed your impatience with the decades of badness, without screaming that it is Grier's fault or Flores's fault (many do just that).

In the same way that so many are willing to give Tua a year to prove it, I am willing to give our line a year to prove it, and in both cases... if they do, we'll have a really UNDERPAID set of stars.

If Tua looks bad, then I'll be here to say that we ought to look around for a new QB. If our line fails to gel, I'll be at the front of the line to beg for better linemen. Neither have proven anything yet, and we have HUGE questions at both QB and OL until they prove themselves-- and I'm OK with that because of how young this team is. If we had a bunch of 30somethings on this team, I'd be a LOT more worried about right now.

 

[utahphinsfan]

Yes, the offensive line is extremely important. The team realizes this

we’ve selected a LT in the 1st round, a T/G in the 2nd, a guard in the 4th. Another OT in the 2nd round this year. Been trying for center upgrades

clearly we know it’s an issue and they are looking to get better there. What else would you have them do? Drafted Sewell over waddle maybe? God not that again

these are young players that need time to develop. If you just keep switching out the pieces, no consistency is ever going to happen. Give them time

Agree especially the last paragraph. Having the standard offseason will help the OL gel. In turn, that will also help Tua

 

[cuzinvinny]

Linsley is the one big miss that I felt we made, but there's only one of him and it just didn't happen. I don't understand the Jackson hate. I thought he played pretty well for a rookie and there's no reason to think that his future isn't bright. The other guys had their moments and we'll just have to wait and see if they continue to progress. They don't all need to make some gigantic leap; just get better.

There were a couple other good Centers. Also think nice RT should be in the picture.


But my reasoning is verified by your statement, you words were " Think the future is bright "

"Other guys had their moments "

" Have to wait and See "
Just doesn't sound real strong

Damn ma, think of the reality that was available to plant a Linsley and a quality RT to our kids....

We'd be on another level. Now for me there is just to much if's and hoping for 4 to 5 improvements to feel comfortable. And IMO people who know a little should see the concern....

 

[utahphinsfan]

Potentially, our line is very good.

Are they good now? We'll know by week 3 or 4.

What they are not is established, and that seems to be what is bugging some people.

Concur. Chemistry & cohesion are crucial to an OL

 

[fansinceGWilson]

Great points @cuzinvinny .

I really like some of the things we've done along the OL, and am encouraged by others .... but we're NOT there yet. Still, there is hope.

Here's the hopeful things I see:

1. Austin Jackson proved he could play
When healthy last year, he was very good, and at LT that's a tough thing to do, so this bodes well for the future. As the youngest OL in his class, he really should be a rookie this year, and he's already shown some great flashes. IMHO, we've found our starting LT already, so that's one spot that is solid.

2. Liam Eichenberg is extremely sound
Mr. Einchredible is one of those golden domers (Notre Dame, not because he's blonde) who is extremely technically sound. An OL prodigy he's not going to make many mistakes, but he will provide solid play protecting Tua's blindside for years to come. He could be another David Bahktiari (sp?) or Andrew Whitworth type OT for us.

3. Hunt is a Guard
Robert Hunt is a mountain of a man, with long arms and some athleticism, but he simply doesn't have the feet or technique to be a blindside OT starter. He received a LOT of help last year, and frankly, we need to spread that help around, not just use it as a Hunt crutch. But as a guard his true mauling nature comes out, and this kid can become very good. IMHO, he has always been a RG and this is the right place for him to excel. He had a promising rookie season making a huge jump from a small school, but this year we should be able to see his prowess in the run game start to shine.

4. Depth
Typically we have a lot of injuries across the OL, which is kinda odd since we're a warm weather team playing on grass ... but I guess our team just isn't very tough. Now with Jesse Davis being able to provide solid play at both OT spots and both OG spots, we can maintain our OL quality. Having Kindley and Hunt battling it out for one OG spot means we have a solid backup if someone gets injured. It's impossible to have complete coverage in his salary cap era, but we have a solid group and some depth.

Here's the worrisome things I see:

5. Dr. Jekyll or Mr. Skura?
Kudos to Skura for returning from a serious injury so quickly. I don't hold his poor performance against him because he shouldn't have even been on the field. Last year he wasn't very good, and got benched. Here's hoping Skura can now return to his ability pre-injury and become a good prospect. But I'm worried that he may never be able to reach that level of play again. We'll see, but I'm not going to hold my breath. Given our continuing fiasco of FA management, either he'll suck and we will cut him, or he'll be great and we'll refuse to pay him ... so either way I see him as a 1-year rental. Oh well, let's hope we get a decent one year. Back to the drafting board I guess.

6. No LG
I'm a big Solomon Kindley fan, and yes, the LG is Tua's front side guard ... but IMHO he just doesn't have the lateral quickness or fluidity passing off stunts and twists against those extra-speedy guys who populate that side of the defense. Kindley is a RG and definitely a phone-booth style player. Jesse Davis may be our best LG player right now, but nobody on our roster is really perfect for the position. I can see Liam Eichenberg fixing that hole if he doesn't work out at RT, but I'd rather have his level of technician at RT protecting Tua's blindside.

At the end of the day, if things progress normally, we should have our LT, RT and RG spots filled and solid depth. That means we'll still be looking for a C and LG in next year's draft. Oh well, the never-ending OL rebuild continues.

I grow weary of these black and white debates. Jackson played poorly, Skura stunk last year, Kindley has slow feet, blah blah.
Conversely, Jackson was young and injured. He WILL be better. Skura WILL play like his pre-injury self.
Personally, I think the entire OL SHOULD be better. Should, but no guarantee. There are concerns across the OL, one of them being lack of experience. I don't know if any of them will be top 5 at their positions. I'd love 2-3 of them to be, but if Flo can get 5 average OLmen, the O will be MUCH better. I expect at least one to disappoint. That's the law of averages. I just hope "disappoint" means average.

 

[Mach2]

Very reasonable approach and I understand though don't necessarily agree with it.
I'm high on our young OL too just not necessarily thinking that there time is better being now for the team. I mean look you got Hunt as one of experience veteran, what, going on year 2......not even got to year 2 yet.

We have the finances and more important the Need. Ya, we want it now ! But lets not forget we've been waiting around and have been dealing with stupidity for over 20 YEARS especially with the OL...

Tired too of all the rediculous pressure put on Tua. We're so lucking we got him...

Well, do we really have the finances? Last I knew, we were pretty much maxed out this year, and last year's Covid cap crunch left most teams in an "on hold" situation as far as future plans.

Yeah, we could have brought in an 8-10 million gaurd or center, but then you don't sign Fuller (just an example).

As to the pressure on Tua? He was a top 5 pick, second QB off the board. QB is the most important single position on any team. Of course there is pressure.

Do we, as hardcore fans overdebate it (Tua) to the point of being ridiculous? Yeah......we do. I can't argue otherwise, but the expectations are that he needs to be a "frachise" QB.

Many highly drafted QBs fail do to the circumstances of their team being a dumster fire franchise. That is not the case here at this point in time. Literally everything else seems to be progressing at an unusually rapid pace.

As the saying goes TT has to $hit, or get off the pot. I believe he can make a huge step forward this year. If he isn't at least good by the end of the season, it is time to consider options.

 

[bradmcnutt13]

There were a couple other good Centers. Also think nice RT should be in the picture.


But my reasoning is verified by your statement, you words were " Think the future is bright "

"Other guys had their moments "

" Have to wait and See "
Just doesn't sound real strong

Damn ma, think of the reality that was available to plant a Linsley and a quality RT to our kids....

We'd be on another level. Now for me there is just to much if's and hoping for 4 to 5 improvements to feel comfortable. And IMO people who know a little should see the concern....

Not really. Andrews was the only other center you can make a case for (excluding Hudson) and I ain't getting worked up over missing out on him. I honestly wished that once we missed on Linsley, we just re-sign Ted. We're building through the draft. We have a bunch of 1st and 2nd year guys. If you don't have the patience to let these guys develop, then obviously this approach isn't gonna work for ya but this is the approach we're taking. And what right tackle are you talking about? Surely not just Moses. There's a reason why the guy is a FA still.

 

[Kyndig]

Pretty much every time I come in here it's, Tua this Tua that, did he wake up on the wrong side of bed, RB issues, do we need upgrade?, WR corp. of real play makers. Team better be improved over last year, Playoffs...." PLAYOFFS ??', Superbowl. Another defensive free agent ?

Wake up people.
Our biggest problem at this point that seems to go under the table but can possibly be the biggest weakness which if it doesn't turn around and successfully jump through a significant amount of hoops which again most are not even putting in discussions, We're Screwed again ! ( don't understand the lack of insight of this team for a legit OL for the last 20 years) were some beauties were there for the taking !!!!!!!!!!!

Its like people are expecting 3 of last years rookies who showed some ups and downs, to all take that significant step (all 3), New Rookie RT not even having a down in the NFL already there. Skura the Karras upgrade having old 2018 abilities or Dieter winning position, also never playing center (NFL)

H E L L O People. This could and IMO IS the #1 weakness of our 2021 Dolphins. AND if all the 1/2 doz.+ upgrades don't happen, the results realistically could be disasters. And the start of many again putting the blame on Tua....

Fans and public should be screaming at the top of their lungs to get the FO to make this upgrade and less dependent on so much improvement to appear by pretty much everyone on the OL.....

I know those truly aware of the realistic values a NFL team needs to be successful but for those who don't, it's not a long shot to tell you to be prepared for a shock.
Now it is true that all the essential improvements by all 5 OL can happen but truthfully no one including the FO should like the odds.

Yes Tua mention but this post is not about Tua so keep him out of it. It's about the Offensive line and will it be what we fantasize or reality is improving but still not much better than average this year.

Importance of OL lets ask possibly the best young QB, out there Mahones and how his OL weakness screwed his timing, play and success....

A ton of resources have been invested in the Oline including: 1 1st round pick 2 2nd round picks, a 4th round pick, and a 7th round pick. SKura, cut flowers (good, no sense having that big of a cap hit if the performance isn’t there he was just average last year) have Jesse Davis coming back. What we have are a lot of promising players that are being developed. Would I have liked to have seen them draft Penei Sewell or another center? Another center for sure, but I’m happy with Waddle, and the truth is the line has had quite a bit of resources and draft capital invested in it the past two years and so now the proof will be on the field. This line should be better than last year’s for sure.

 

[dolfan91]

Apparently Kindley and Skura were seen putting in extra work after OTA sessions ended. Hopefully that's a good sign and turns into better results.

 

[Dan13Forever]

From the OTA rumour mill, Davis is starting, and Dieter is given a chance to challenge. Kindley lost the starting position.

 

[PHINSfan]

A lot of good points brought up here. My main concern regarding the Oline is Coaching. Our new Oline coach has very little experience, and as many have said our Oline is very young. Give these players to the patriots Oline coach and he will make these guys play at a top level. Of course there arent too many coaches like that, but I wondered why our front office didnt bring in an experienced Oline coach. Even if they had to get one from college. Someone who has had a history of developing Oline players. Well....all we can do is wait and see how much improvement these young guys make.

 

[Padfoot]

O-line has never been the most interesting unit to discuss for most people. Of course most will talk about the QB, receivers, and defense more often.

The young linemen on this team have shown enough to be given another year to see if they can improve. Spending big in FA or overdrafting, at the expense of other positions, is never a recipe for success.

 

[Lionstone]

Unfortunately when they drafted Jackson and Iggy in the first round in 2020, it was stated at the time that both of them were young players who needed further development before they could reach their potential.

These type players are usually drafted in the middle rounds of the draft with the hope they will eventually develop as NFL players. The Dolphins for some reason decided to draft two developmental players in round one in 2020. Hopefully these two players do end up being solid starters in the NFL or we will be looking back in a few years and realize Grier wasted much of the 2020. draft

In general developmental players are drafted in the middle rounds, but Jackson has too much athletic talent to be drafted that late. I can agree that he might have been draft too early, but middle rounds is a ludicrous statement to me.