****Tua Tagovailoa super thread****

[SignoreOscuro]

if the injury is the problem why should the dolphins pick him? An bad injury in Ohio is not a bad injury in Florida?

 

[Avigatorx]

I'm a Chiefs fan, I'll say that first. I was bouncing off the walls when we traded up to #10 for Mahomes. You guys want Tua to be Mahomes, but there are a few differences you're ignoring, willfully or not.

A team that takes Tua top 5 and doesn't have a mentorship plan for him is asking for failure. The Chiefs drafted Mahomes to be the QBOTF (not expecting him to put up the numbers he did in 2018) when they already had a decent QB in Alex Smith. Alex was an absolutely awesome mentor for Mahomes, knowing that he was teaching the guy who would take his job. Mahomes could take a year learning the offense, learning how to lead, and learning how to learn in the NFL. The Chiefs wanted him not just because of his arm strength, but because of his ability to memorize and repeat information, but that still takes time for an entire playbook. A QB has to know every aspect of every play to be as good as Mahomes was in 2018, as good as Brees is, as Brady is. Tua's got the physical talents to be good, but Geno Smith looked good enough for some (moronic) Chiefs fans to want him a few years ago, too. I was absolutely not in that boat. Beware of the teammates making a decent player look amazing. (Ryan Leaf, Julius Peppers made Ryan Sims look good and the Chiefs passed on guys like John Henderson and Dwight Freeney... they even traded up to get him)

The hip injury is only part of his medical history, and a team thinking that they'll have him play in 2020 is foolish. The best situation for him would be rehabbing and learning for a year, maybe starting on IR like Drew Lock was able to do for the Donkeys this year.

Tannehill sure looks like a decent QB, even unseating Mariota. I'm guessing that this angst is part of what leads some of you to be so infatuated with Tua; you just want that franchise QB. I agree with those of you who are ok getting him at 5, but not trading up. If you can't mentor the guy, he may be a bust, anyway.

Im not sure which part we are ignoring. Most of us want Tua to sit for a year like Mahomes did In fact, we all understand he will need time to completely heal. We are rebuilding, not in win now mode.

Tua is known for having elite level speed in processing defenses, far more than just a guy with a good arm on a stacked team.

And Fitz is a pretty god mentor for a young player.

Thanks for the input, bu I think we have our bases covered.

 

[andyahs]

if the injury is the problem why should the dolphins pick him? An bad injury in Ohio is not a bad injury in Florida?

They would pick him if the injury is not the problem.......but Ohio?

 

[meatpardle]

Just because you're not ignoring it doesn't mean there aren't quite a few who are. They think mortgaging your future on a guy who won't be healthy enough to work out fully by the time he's drafted is a great plan, and if you don't agree you're crazy. I read the other thread.

Well yes much like most of the internet we have a wide range of posters who cover the whole spectrum of crazy to reasonable and back again.

Your post implied that the general approach was to draft Tua as he is the trendy pick with all the physical tools without any consideration for how he will develop and what other skills he might need to succeed. For the majority that's pretty far from the truth.

 

[Avigatorx]

Just because you're not ignoring it doesn't mean there aren't quite a few who are. They think mortgaging your future on a guy who won't be healthy enough to work out fully by the time he's drafted is a great plan, and if you don't agree you're crazy. I read the other thread.

How would we be mortgaging the future? Bro, we have 13 picks in this year's draft, 5 picks in the first 2 rounds.

We've also got 2 first round picks next year.

Our future will be fine if we have to trade up.

 

[meatpardle]

if the injury is the problem why should the dolphins pick him? An bad injury in Ohio is not a bad injury in Florida?

Because Joe Burrow, the guy with the stats and the prizes, and the home-state guy, is sat there to take at #1 and will not be at #5. The Bengals are not a high-functioning organisation, they are are not going to question that to consider the guy with the injury. Would they question it if Tua had not had an injury and had another great season? Who knows, but the answer to your question is that we take him because he's there while Cincy don't because they have the Joe Burrow option.

 

[phins_4_ever]

1. Tua injured his hip.

2. They're the Bengals.

It's the injury, plain and simple. If Tua wasn't injured he most definitely would be in the mix for the Bengals

So far I got:
- the Bengals are stupid
- his hip

That does not explain why everybody thinks the Dolphins should sell the house and move up to #2 if possible to grab him. So his injury is good enough for a #2 pick but not a #1? That does not make any sense especially if we consider to give up a lot of draft picks to move up.

I haven't seen anyone say Burrow is bad or even not good.

+'s for Tua

- multiple years of elite/historic play
- significantly better career
- better arm talent
- younger

+'s for Burrow

- doesn't have Tua's injury concerns
- even better pocket manipulation
- can play Day 1

Ask anyone who pays attention, and they'll tell you that a longer track record of elite play absolutely matters. If Cincinnati wasn't coming off a 1-15 season, and if they weren't an aimless franchise with a terrible HC, I think Tua would be in play at #1. But, I don't see Cincinnati considering the big picture, especially with Burrow being the fan/media favorite + coming from Ohio.

I'd be happy with either for Miami, but I'd prefer Tua.

My "horrible and awful" was an intended exaggeration of "Tua is wayyyyy better than everybody else" (and that is the gentle version).
We both know that Burrow probably will sit behind Dalton for a year much like Mahomes did behind Alex Smith so I am putting the "Day 1 can play" on the backburner a little. To use the 1-15 record (it was actually 2-14) as an excuse not to take Tua is a stretch. Last time I checked half the board was ready to take him at #1 with an 0-16 record. And to be honest using the record as an excuse to take one QB over the other is a little bit weird. I always thought that if you have the chance at your franchise QB you take it - no matter when, where and what your record is.

You tried better but in the end we reduce it to:
- Bengals stupid


Gentlemen, Bengals stupid is not good enough. If the Miami Dolphins should trade valuable draft capital to make that moronic move up to #2 (or 3) because he is so great why in the Spaghetti Monster's Name would the Bengals not take Tua? Bengals stupid? That's it.

 

[phins_4_ever]

Burrows isn't a horrible PROSPECT .In fact he proved he belonged at the top of the draft with his play this season.He ran a pro style offense in the toughest conference the SEC and he dominated.He took home the Heisman and rightfully so .His TD to INT ratio was top notch and his receiving core wasn't half as good as Tua's.We will see him crush the combine this year and he should win the National Championship.He doesn't have the injury concern that Tua has.

You don't have to convince me.

 

[Rev Kev]

The question nobody has answered me yet is: if Tua is the next best thing since sliced bread why would the Bengals pass on him and settle for the "horrible and awful" Burrow?

It has only been answered a thousand times in this site - Tua is injured (there is risk with the pick) he may need a full season - (they have. A cheap owner they don’t have a cache of picks if things go sour) he is not a local boy and the flavour of the day (he is the forgotten one) Tua didn’t win the Heisman Right?

There are streams and streams of this very answer on this site - I thought you were a mod?

 

[DPhinz_DPhinz]

By the way to all you Jordan Love fans after watching his game vs LSU I can say he has special arm abilities but to he has a long way to go in his pass accuracy and knowing how to put touch on his throws.. If he is drafted he needs to sit for 1 or maybe 2 season's for his best chance of success. I know is Utah State vs LSU but really the time he had to throw is comparable to what he can expect in the NFL or even less.

That being said I think Love has a better chance of NFL success then Herbert does in my book

The talent level between Utah State's WRs and LSU's defensive backs is about a light year more than the perceived talent level between Love and Tua.

It's almost funny you would use that to contrast him and Tua on a Tua thread

 

[NBP81]

If the Miami Dolphins should trade valuable draft capital to make that moronic move up to #2 (or 3) because he is so great why in the Spaghetti Monster's Name would the Bengals not take Tua? Bengals stupid? That's it.

I think your hate for Tua is clouding your judgement...

The actual argument for moving up to #2 is to make sure we secure either the QB1 or QB2 in this draft regardless of who you think is 1 or 2... Because the gap between QB1 and Q2 is minimal compared to the gap between QB2 and QB3... Thats all there is to it...

 

[meatpardle]

So far I got:
- the Bengals are stupid
- his hip

That does not explain why everybody thinks the Dolphins should sell the house and move up to #2 if possible to grab him. So his injury is good enough for a #2 pick but not a #1? That does not make any sense especially if we consider to give up a lot of draft picks to move up.

Everybody does not think that. It would take #3, and even then I doubt that either i) it would be required, or ii) if it was required the cost would be that high.

And why is it OK to draft injured Tua with the #3 pick but not the #1? Because Joe Burrow is sat there at #1 and the Bengals aren't ever going to question that pick to consider an injured Tua. We don't have that option so we can (or have to) look deeper and consider the bigger picture given our different options than those that the Bengals have.

What would be interesting is if Burrow and Tua were both there with our pick, either because we had the #1 pick or if a teams without a QB need were picking before us. But that isn't the case, Tua is the best QB available to us but comes with the massive asterisk of his injury. That's why we have to decide if he's worth it with his injury status when the Bengals can convince themselves that they don't.

 

[Phinatic8u]

This throw right here is why you draft Tua.

The anticipation and accuracy is 2nd to none.

 

[jbyrd850]

Pre injury I’d be ok with trading up for Tua, he’s an amazing QB prospect.

After the hip though, I don’t want to give up additional picks to take him. It’s not the same risk pre-injury.

If he’s there at 5 which I believe he will be and the front office says he’s the guy and the drs sign off then go for it. But I won’t be disappointed if they either trade back and get more picks or take a guy like Andrew Thomas, Jeff Okudah, Isiah Simmons, or Ceedee Lamb. All of whom I think are going to be great nfl players.

 

[Rev Kev]

This throw right here is why you draft Tua.

The anticipation and accuracy is 2nd to none.

Money