What young quarterback has succeeded…. | Page 5 | FinHeaven - Miami Dolphins Forums

What young quarterback has succeeded….

I like Tua and he is our QB so I support him, however if we fix the OL and get a competent HC and OC and he cannot produce then good luck to him elsewhere. I had always hoped RT17 would have had that opportunity but he had to wait til he got to the Titans. This organization has been run as dysfunctional as the federal government. Hope springs eternal for us, at the beginning of every year.
 
Yessir said:
When their offensive line has given up the most pressures in the NFL, and has a bottom 3 rushing offense?

Can anyone help me find one in NFL history?
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This you?

Good quarterbacking is innate.

"He needs another year of development" LOL. Please. Spare me that drivel. You either have it or you don't. Great quarterbacks are BORN, they are not developed. There are natural instincts, intangibles, and leadership qualities that come with it, and you can usually tell immediately when one...
finheaven.com finheaven.com
 
GatorFin73 said:
Ok, how about not so good? Point is we are listing all the reasons the QB play has been lackluster, underwhelming, pick your favorite word. The reasons are good but they are being discussed to explain why the QB performance hasn't been good relative to others.

One point that seems to often be left out of all this reasoning is that Tua enjoyed a much better defense than Burrow/Herbert. That defense, particularly during the win streak, was only giving up 11 points a game, giving our offense the ball back time and time again, scoring even sometimes. People are leaving that out of the equation as they throw out Tua's W-L record. Only want to discuss the bad line and running game which is fair but Tua has had a big advantage with the quality of his defense relative to these other guys.
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Totally fair to point out Tua’s defense but these things all work together. We had a ball control offense and an elite defense. We weren’t trying to throw for 350 yards. We were trying to get an early lead and protect it. The Chargers and Bengals didn’t play that style. They built around and tried to win via elite offense, not elite defense.

Ultimately, if you take the quarterbacks out of the equation entirely for the Bengals, Chargers, and Dolphins, I have a very hard time believing that the rest of the Dolphins’ roster is significantly better than the rest of the Bengals’ or Chargers’ rosters. In fact, I think we’re worse than both right now. We saw what the Dolphins were with Jacoby Brissett. It was not pretty. I don’t think the Chargers or Bengals with Jacoby Brissett are any worse.
 
PhinFan1968 said:
Truth. And, IMO, he deserves at least another year to prove his worth, based on his entire body of work so far.

I will say, however, that I believe he has trended downward over the last 4 games or so, of the season. His Tennessee performance was by-far the worst he's had that I know of. He was off-target on many passes, including some completions, and at times had no pressure. That pass he threw at Hollins' feet when he was rolling left disgusted me...it wasn't a long throw and it looked like he put a lot of torque into the delivery. Then against the Patriots he was pedestrian, aside from the clutch plays with his legs...had a couple nice throws, but had some meh mixed in there as well.

I'm willing to believe it was mostly due to the strained situation with the coach and the effects that situation had on the offense overall, but we won't know to what extent that messed him up, until at least next year. If he comes out inaccurate through camp/pre-season and into the season, it's not looking good IMO. Not worried it will happen, just braced for it.

He will be under his 3rd offense in 3 years...I really hate inconsistency, but it is what it is. He's gotta grasp it quick, as well as the rest of the offense. 2021's early games on offense were disjointed very badly, and it was because most of the offensive players aside from Tua didn't fully get the playbook. Hate to have to see that happen again next year.
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Tua has a problem playing in bad weather, so he will need to prove he can do it going forward, and playing in the East, he will get plenty of chances I am sure.

The good news is, Tua is aware of his deficiencies, and said he will be working out in the off-season, in bad weather cities to get better.

Expecting the Oline issue to somewhat to actually getting fixed this offseason, along with probably more dependable Receivers, and a better running game, so it will literally be up to Tua to show what type of QB he actually is. 🤞
 
Having good skill players will take the pressure off of a poor or inexperienced offensive line.

For instance, if we had a good running back (I mean a real power back), then defenses would be less willing to gamble on blitzes. I would be interested to know how often defenses blitzed on the Dolphins last season. Of course, it's possible they didn't even need to blitz the Dolphins to keep pressure on the QB. What I know is that even the Jets had more rushing yards than the Dolphins, and every contender I looked at had at least 400 more rushing yards.

I figure this is why the RPO was important to Miami.
 
Delvin said:
Winning is a team game.
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Agree.

Tua didn't lose us any games though, so there's that. At least we know he shows up in the 4th instead of folding. Winning though, definitely a team stat.

We'll be all like, "damn, if we only had a better OL and running game we'd have a better idea if our QB was the QB of the future."

And those other teams' fans be all like, "damn, we got the QB, just need a defense and we're set."

Both short.
 
Yessir said:
When their offensive line has given up the most pressures in the NFL, and has a bottom 3 rushing offense?

Can anyone help me find one in NFL history?
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I don't think there is one. I think back to the beating Jim Plunkett took in New England years back. Then he gets with Oakland and resurrects his career. Steve Young was a similar story from Tampa Bay to San Francisco.

I think Tua did really well this year when you factor in what he had to work with. He had about a six-game stretch where he played really well. I do wish he had finished stronger, but I think he faced defenses at the end who adjusted to what Miami was doing. The offense was just so limited by the play of the offensive line.
 
GhostArmOfMarino said:
I evaluate Tua based on his skill set and how it meshes with the things a modern NFL QB is asked to do, how I evaluate every player.

I also don't hold Tua blameless for our offense, we are using a lot of his Alabama concepts offensively, so he's basically causing us to run a college offense. Or the staff didn't trust him to run a normal playbook, whatever the case is, the RPO will always be a short passing game offense for the most part. You can take chances, but by its very nature it's not built to exploit the deep intermediate and deep portions of the field in the NFL.

I'm willing to roll with Tua another year though with improvements to coaching and the offense.

I'm not saying he can't succeed, I'm just being honest in how I view his skill set.
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Tua is causing us to run a college offense? You do realize that he ran a pro style offense at Alabama, right?

Not that there is that much distinction these days. After 2012 and 2012 the NFL stopped being prudish about what was or wasn't professional since it was found that schemes that make execution easier and have a lot of deception are pretty darn cool, actually.
 
rent this space said:
apparently not better than Tua
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Mac Jones (ROOKIE) 2021 season stats:
3,801
22td
13int
92.5 rating

Tua Tagovailoa 2nd season( NOT ROOKIE)
2,653
16td
10int
90.1 rating

OK let excuses come now I’ve already got them all anticipated. There’s so many of them I’m not even going to bother typing them.


Mac Jones was sacked 28 times
Tua Tagovailoa sacked 20 times
New England must have a crappy line!
 
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Marino2.0 said:
Andrew Luck retired at 29 in large part due to the beating he took behind that garbage offensive line. He was on pace to be a first ballot Hall of Famer and rewrite the record books to that point. Even still, our OL this year was worse than any Luck played behind.
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Two generational type quarterbacks, one succeeded behind a bad line and one didn’t.
 
Sirspud said:
Tua is causing us to run a college offense? You do realize that he ran a pro style offense at Alabama, right?

Not that there is that much distinction these days. After 2012 and 2012 the NFL stopped being prudish about what was or wasn't professional since it was found that schemes that make execution easier and have a lot of deception are pretty darn cool, actually.
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Im not saying Tua went and said, hey coach we need to run a college offense.

The line is blurred more than ever I agree, but a lot of the concepts we ran aren't typically successful in the NFL as a primary mover.

Also maybe I should reword, I'm not saying its his fault per se, I'm saying its what the staff thought he would be best at for whatever reason and I don't particularly love the RPO in the NFL. I have no idea how KC makes it work as well as they do when they run it, because in my eyes it's flawed.
 
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